help me understand Wolf ammo

[DrBaker]

I'm looking for .223 ammo for my ARs.

I've been told by many folks to stay away from the filthy mess these leave if you don't want to spend all day cleaning your gun. I see references to lacquer coated and polymer coated Wolf ammo. Is the lacquer the old and the polymer the new stuff produced or do they still make both? Is the lacquer coated stuff the one that makes for a filthy gun? Is the polymer stuff supposed to be similar to WWB, etc?

I checked the Wolf webiste www.wolfammo.com and it talks about the new polyformance polymer coating.

Any advice would be appreciated.

[MDT]

I have wondered the same thing. I have toyed with getting a couple of cases of 5.56 "just in case". My limited experience with it was while shooting at Red Castle years ago, the guy next to me with a Colt AR shooting the 62 gr. Wolf had his "bolt seize up" (not sure what that meant) and he said he had to now take the thing to his gunsmith to fix it. In short, he blamed the ammo. This may or may not be valid. I would like some schoolin' on the Wolf as well :)

[skyydiver]

I don't know much. But I believe that the old lacquer coating was dirtier than the polymer. AND they are boxer primed, which I believe is also a dirtier primer. The guys on most of the AK sites have no trouble with it, but clean after every session (kind of rare for AK owners I think). I would guess that I wouldn't mind using it in my $300 SAR-1, but I probably would be more reluctant if I get a $1200 AR.

[Mack45]

My 2 cents. Wolf is just fine for your AKs and SKSs. But I will not feed it to my AR. It Is dirty and stinks. I have shot quite a bit of it thru my SKS with no problems and A lot of people shoot it in THEIR ARs and swear by it. I guess that I am an ammo snob when it comes to my AR. The cheapesr stuff I feed mine is Wally Wolrd Remmington 55 gr. FMJ. But I probably dont shoot over 500 rounds per year thru mine. Like I said just my two cents worth.

[Scott_In_OKC]

Most of the stuff I read dealt with the lacquer heating up, coming off the cases and then gumming up the chamber. I believe that is why Wolf switched to the polymer. I only shoot USGI stuff in my AR (mainly because I have a LOT of it :))

[DrBaker]

Were is a good place to buy USGI stuff? Is this range friendly (h and h approved)? Can it be purchased for a decent price locally to save on shipping? Is it brass or steel cased?

Sorry for so many questions, but I'm sure others will appreciate your experience too.

[Scott_In_OKC]

Yes, it's H&H range friendly. Just standard military brass cased FMJ stuff. I bought mine from 1Shott. I haven't seen him around in awhile, but I think you can find him on AR15.com.

This thread on AR15.com is constantly updated with prices and availability.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=222888

[skyydiver]

Sorry for so many questions, but I'm sure others will appreciate your experience too.

Fo shizzle. I know I would. I want an AR soon. Hey doc. Did you mount that surefire on the AR? Hope you like it. I sure am happy with the little wonder.

[DrBaker]

Fo shizzle. I know I would. I want an AR soon. Hey doc. Did you mount that surefire on the AR? Hope you like it. I sure am happy with the little wonder.

Not yet. I'm waiting to get a good forend first. I'm not really wanting to mount directly to the barrel. Hopefully I'll find a steal on a DD or similar.

[Mack45]

Doc, Is your AR chambered in .223 or 5.56? That is one thing to check before shooting USGI.

[GMThunder]

I've used a ton of wolf in my hanguns. The laquer stuff is the old and the polymer is the new. The Polymer shoots much cleaner than the old stuff and a little cleaner than Winchester Dirty Box IMHO.

[skyydiver]

Not yet. I'm waiting to get a good forend first. I'm not really wanting to mount directly to the barrel. Hopefully I'll find a steal on a DD or similar.

Most definitely. I wouldn't clamp anything to the barrel of a nice gun myself. It worked great on the AK, but the finish on that was rough anyway.

[liliysdad]

Doc, I have shot quite a bit of the new poly stuff through my Armalite AR. It shoots fine, and isnt a bit dirtier than the Wal Mart WWB Ive shot. It is a bit anemic, but it shoots to POA at 50 yds. Its not the best ammo, but it does function.

I have also tried the Monarch ammo sold by Academy Sports. It is Barnaul ammo repackaged. This is really good ammo. Considerably more potent than the Wolf, and doesnt smell as funny. I think it sells for 2.80 a box.

[DrBaker]

Doc, Is your AR chambered in .223 or 5.56? That is one thing to check before shooting USGI.

One says 5.56 on the barrel.

The other says "C MP Chrome Bore" on the barrel. Can somebody translate this?

[DrBaker]

The laquer stuff is the old and the polymer is the new. The Polymer shoots much cleaner than the old stuff and a little cleaner than Winchester Dirty Box IMHO.

So they no longer produce the laquer stuff?

How can I tell which I'm getting? I don't want to put anything through my ARs that's worse than WWB.

[Mack45]

The 5.56 Is OK for USGI, you can shoot .223 in it as well. You just shouldn't shoot 5.56 in a .223. The C is Colt, MP is magnetic particle tested, I think.

[ShawnatOSU]

Wolf makes great 22LR match target and match extra. However ive shot there 9mm stuff and out of a box of 50 prolly 10 or so didnt fire. As far as there rifles stuff the 7.62x39mm is good stuff for ak's and SKS's. But im still undecided on the 223 stuff. Ive seen people shoot it, but idunno for some odd reason I always seem to get the winchester 5.56mm.

[brennan]

The 5.56 Is OK for USGI, you can shoot .223 in it as well. You just shouldn't shoot 5.56 in a .223. The C is Colt, MP is magnetic particle tested, I think.

What about the 223 Wyle barrel is it suppose to either equally?

[Mack45]

The Wylde chamber is supposed to be "in between". A bit longer than .223 but still a bit shorter than 5.56.

[bratch]

I thought I heard somewhere Wolf doesn't actually produce ammo just distributes it. I have shot the 223 in my AR and VEPR with no problems. I remember reading on arfcom where someone took a torch trying to get the laquer to come off and couldn't. Tromix also posted on arfcom that Wolf wouldn't damage your gun.

[GMThunder]

So they no longer produce the laquer stuff?

How can I tell which I'm getting? I don't want to put anything through my ARs that's worse than WWB.

The handgun stuff has gone to all polymer.....there is still some laquer stuff out there though..... not sure about rifle ammo.

[okgr8outdrs]

Here is an excerpt from the AR15.com Ammo Oracle...

Q. What is the difference between 5.56×45mm and .223 Remington ammo?
In the 1950's, the US military adopted the metric system of measurement and uses metric measurements to describe ammo. However, the US commercial ammo market typically used the English "caliber" measurements when describing ammo. "Caliber" is a shorthand way of saying "hundredths (or thousandths) of an inch." For example, a fifty caliber projectile is approximately fifty one-hundredths (.50) of an inch and a 357 caliber projectile is approximately three-hundred and fifty-seven thousandths (.357) of an inch. Dimensionally, 5.56 and .223 ammo are identical, though military 5.56 ammo is typically loaded to higher pressures and velocities than commercial ammo and may, in guns with extremely tight "match" .223 chambers, be unsafe to fire.

The chambers for .223 and 5.56 weapons are not the same either. Though the AR15 design provides an extremely strong action, high pressure signs on the brass and primers, extraction failures and cycling problems may be seen when firing hot 5.56 ammo in .223-chambered rifles. Military M16s and AR15s from Colt, Bushmaster, FN, DPMS, and some others, have the M16-spec chamber and should have no trouble firing hot 5.56 ammunition.

Military M16s have slightly more headspace and have a longer throat area, compared to the SAAMI .223 chamber spec, which was originally designed for bolt-action rifles. Commercial SAAMI-specification .223 chambers have a much shorter throat or leade and less freebore than the military chamber. Shooting 5.56 Mil-Spec ammo in a SAAMI-specification chamber can increase pressure dramatically, up to an additional 15,000 psi or more.

The military chamber is often referred to as a "5.56 NATO" chamber, as that is what is usually stamped on military barrels. Some commercial AR manufacturers use the tighter ".223" (i.e., SAAMI-spec and often labeled ".223" or ".223 Remington") chamber, which provides for increased accuracy but, in self-loading rifles, less cycling reliability, especially with hot-loaded military ammo. A few AR manufacturers use an in-between chamber spec, such as the Wylde chamber. Many mis-mark their barrels too, which further complicates things. You can generally tell what sort of chamber you are dealing with by the markings, if any, on the barrel, but always check with the manufacturer to be sure.

Typical Colt Mil-Spec-type markings: C MP 5.56 NATO 1/7

Typical Bushmaster markings: B MP 5.56 NATO 1/9 HBAR

DPMS marks their barrels ".223", though they actually have 5.56 chambers.

Olympic Arms marks their barrels with "556", with some additionally marked "SS" or "SUM." This marking is used on all barrels, even older barrels that used .223 chambers and current target models that also use .223 chambers. Non-target barrels made since 2001 should have 5.56 chambers.

Armalite typically doesn't mark their barrels. A2 and A4 models had .223 chambers until mid-2001, and have used 5.56 chambers since. The (t) models use .223 match chambers.

Rock River Arms uses the Wylde chamber specs on most rifles, and does not mark their barrels.

Most other AR manufacturers' barrels are unmarked, and chamber dimensions are unknown.

[liliysdad]

Wolf is a producer of ammo on a limited basis. I belive they have a factory in Russia..if I remember right, its the Tula factory. However, some of their amm is manufactured in Germany. I knw the .22LR and their shotgun ammo is all German made. Its great stuff, too.


I like Wolf just fine...and its cheap.