Self-Defense Knife Recommendation to ALL

[OKSDC]

Ok, so let me preface this by saying I do realize that there is already a knife thread at the top of the forum, and I am too lazy to go through the 10 pages of comments to see if this was discussed, so if it has, Admins please move the topic to that thread. If not, then here we go...

I want to talk to you about an incident that occurred recently where an officer was shot and killed by his own gun. Some of the LEOs out there will know what I am talking about and out of respect for the families, please do not mention names or critique the situation etc. If you want to do so then message me directly and we will go from there.

To sum it up and without getting into specifics, the officer ended up on his back with assailant on top of the officer and a struggle ensued over the officers gun. The officer lost. Why I bring this up is that it got me thinking at the time about what other options there are that could readily be available in tight quarters locked up in a fight to protect yourself and increase your chances in weapon retention. The baton needed the ability to generate power in the swing for it to be effective and when locked up is next to impossible, as well as the drawing methods are normally done with the strong hand Well after a knife course, I had already purchased the K-Bar TDI knife after seeing the video online about it as well, showing how much quicker and easier it is to deploy then my auto open knife. Another thing I thought about was that I had always carried my knives on my strong side. Well when you are trying to retain your weapon in a struggle you are going to almost certainly use your strong side hand to do so, but if you are locking your weapon into the holster with the strong side hand or if you have it in your hand already, you are obviously not going to be able to deploy the knife if it too is on the strong side.

The K-Bar TDI is designed to be worn on your weak side on your belt, so that in the event of trying to secure your weapon, maintain your grip on an already deployed weapon, or if you are trying to disengage to get to your weapon, the knife will be deployed with your weak hand. There is a video on YouTube showing how much faster the knife is to deploy weak handed, than it is to deply an auto open k I've with your strong hand. It also is extremely easy to deploy when you are locked up and have to move in tight quarters, just by placing anywhere in front of your weak side hip. The knife itself is less than $40.00 and conceals as if it is nothing. To me, the incident previously mentioned, just played over and over in my head, what could have happened if I was in that situation, and if I had the TDI on my person, would it have at the worst, hopefully, given me a fighting chance? I have to think it would, and to me for $40.00, it is something that I would rather say I had and did not need, than to say (or my family), I wish I would have had it.

Every since then, I truly believe in the benefits of the TDI that I have made it a point to tell every academy firearms block, or public firearms class, to encourage others to go out and buy one themselves. After demonstrating it to classes as well as having them see the video on it, most agree and go out and get one themselves. I too hope you all will look into purchasing one or something similar.....

[bulbboy]

The TDI has been favored for years here on Okshooters.

Neve hurts to bump it up for the newer guys

Thanks

[Remington]

Thanks for the post. i appreciate the info. I looking on youtube right now.

[winehead]

thanks for your post, I too appreciate the info.

[ExSniper]

I carry one behind my mag pouches on my duty belt so I can easily access it with my off hand.

[prdator]

The TDI knife is a good knife to carry and the good thing about it like you said its ONLY about $40!!! I much prefer the Clinch Pick by Shivworks ( shivworks.com ) Craig Douglas, aka Southnarc is a Good friend of mine so I may be a bit biased, and right now you cant find a CP but he will have a production version out soon.

I think a point that needs to be brought up is its not always the "hardware" taking training classes such as ECQC and CQT will teach you the Pre assault indicators, how to mange unknown contacts and how to improve your hand to hand skills. Watching a video is a great place to start but from there I recommend you, Train ( find professional training that focuses on the area your weak at) Practice, once you have had the training dedicate practice time to the material you learned, Pressure Test, make sure what you learned will stand up to Pressure via a training group or partner and this needs to be done in a "non agreed" way ( you don't know the intent of the role players) then Evaluate did the training and Hardware work together? what do you need to practice on to make it work better?? This applies for both LEO's and regular joes!!!!!

It is sad state but most LEO's training is NOT sufficient, Prayers to the officers family and loves ones!!!!!!

[OKSDC]

The TDI knife is a good knife to carry and the good thing about it like you said its ONLY about $40!!! I much prefer the Clinch Pick by Shivworks ( shivworks.com ) Craig Douglas, aka Southnarc is a Good friend of mine so I may be a bit biased, and right now you cant find a CP but he will have a production version out soon.

I think a point that needs to be brought up is its not always the "hardware" taking training classes such as ECQC and CQT will teach you the Pre assault indicators, how to mange unknown contacts and how to improve your hand to hand skills. Watching a video is a great place to start but from there I recommend you, Train ( find professional training that focuses on the area your weak at) Practice, once you have had the training dedicate practice time to the material you learned, Pressure Test, make sure what you learned will stand up to Pressure via a training group or partner and this needs to be done in a "non agreed" way ( you don't know the intent of the role players) then Evaluate did the training and Hardware work together? what do you need to practice on to make it work better?? This applies for both LEO's and regular joes!!!!!

It is sad state but most LEO's training is NOT sufficient, Prayers to the officers family and loves ones!!!!!!

Totally agree on a lot of what you said concerning needing to train, but I would say more than anything it starts with the mindset of I will do anything to go home. That was kind of where I was going with the point of the thread. I never wanted people to think that the video in and of itself was "training" but to just look at it for a visual aid as to the reason behind the knife or others like it. Truth is that even officers who receive training at some point, most will never practice afterwards. A lot of the public wont have the the means to attend training such as that, and for that reason is why I at least recommend the equipment to at least have another tool on the belt to go home.

In the end though, like you said, equipment alone will not solve your problem.

[saddlebum]

I apologize for my remarks,thanks for your effort

[gillman7]

The challenge that I always see on this, is in Oklahoma, a civilian cannot carry a fixed blade knife. Seems silly to me, that I can carry a handgun that can fire a projectile at over 1000 FPS, but cannot carry a knife to defend myself within 3' of my body.

[Coded-Dude]

The challenge that I always see on this, is in Oklahoma, a civilian cannot carry a fixed blade knife. Seems silly to me, that I can carry a handgun that can fire a projectile at over 1000 FPS, but cannot carry a knife to defend myself within 3' of my body.

Wait.......what?

I was under the impression that a "dagger," "bowie knife," or "dirk" are illegal(just like here in CA). Not all fixed blades are considered to be within those classifications. Or am I wrong/missing something? I have carried my fixed blade(Buck Vanguard) in OK(when visiting) in front of LEO with no issues(maybe I just got lucky)....

[gillman7]

It is a matter of interpretation of the officer involved. Some say any fixed blade, some say it depends on one or two sided points sharpened, etc. I err on the side of caution, had several knives confiscated....

[OKSDC]

I apologize for my remarks,thanks for your effort

Not an issue. Accepted. Read response I sent you in PM as I believe it is better addressed off thread and between us. I appreciate the gesture as well as you giving me another perspective on my posts that I had not considered.

[OKSDC]

It is a matter of interpretation of the officer involved. Some say any fixed blade, some say it depends on one or two sided points sharpened, etc. I err on the side of caution, had several knives confiscated....

Here's the actual law:

"UNLAWFUL CARRY

A. It shall be unlawful for any person to carry upon or about his or her person, or in a purse or other container belonging to the person, any pistol, revolver, shotgun or rifle whether loaded or unloaded or any dagger, bowie knife, dirk knife, switchblade knife, spring-type knife, sword cane, knife having a blade which opens automatically by hand pressure applied to a button, spring, or other device in the handle of the knife, blackjack, loaded cane, billy, hand chain, metal knuckles, or any other offensive weapon, whether such weapon be concealed or unconcealed, except this section shall not prohibit:

1. The proper use of guns and knives for hunting, fishing, educational or recreational purposes;

2. The carrying or use of weapons in a manner otherwise permitted by statute or authorized by the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act;

3. The carrying, possession and use of any weapon by a peace officer or other person authorized by law to carry a weapon in the performance of official duties and in compliance with the rules of the employing agency;

4. The carrying or use of weapons in a courthouse by a district judge, associate district judge or special district judge within this state, who is in possession of a valid handgun license issued pursuant to the provisions of the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act and whose name appears on a list maintained by the Administrative Director of the Courts; or

5. The carrying and use of firearms and other weapons provided in this subsection when used for the purpose of living history reenactment. For purposes of this paragraph, "living history reenactment" means depiction of historical characters, scenes, historical life or events for entertainment, education, or historical documentation through the wearing or use of period, historical, antique or vintage clothing, accessories, firearms, weapons, and other implements of the historical period.

B. Any person convicted of violating the foregoing provision shall be guilty of a misdemeanor punishable as provided in Section 1276 of this title."

I do agree that it can be interpreted differently by different people or LEO's. My personal interpretation of a dagger is a fixed blade with 2 edged sides. I don't personally know of anyone that I have worked with who has confiscated a standard fix blade from a law abiding citizen, nor do I personally know anyone who has had this happened to them. I have no doubt however, that there would be an LEO out there who would be so "Johnny Law" that he would do that just because he "can." I would hope an LEO you came across would use some common sense, but I guess in your experience you have not been so lucky. If you don't mind my asking, where did this happen that you got a knife confiscated just because it was a fixed blade? Also, was there any other reason you had contact with that LEO in question besides just wearing a fixed blade? Did you get charged or cited?

While I don't encourage people to break the law (if a standard fixed blade was to be considered a dagger), how would anyone know you had it on? The phrase "better to be tried by 12 then carried by 6" seems appropriate in this scenario

[ripnbst]

I err on the side of caution, had several knives confiscated....

At what age were knives confiscated? I think kids or young adults involved are likely to be "made an example" more than as an adult. I don't carry a fixed blade on my person, I rock a folder though based on what I read mine would technically be in a grey area too. It's a Kershaw speed safe mechanism with a torsion bar assist opening.

[gillman7]

Mine was both times when I was younger, once in high school in Owasso, another time, I was coming back from hunting, had on full camo, rifle was in the back window of the pick up, and had a skinning knife on my belt, in Tulsa.

Both times, had the whole, "I could take you in for this illegal knife....." "I will give you a break this time, and just confiscate the knife" spiel. The last time was about 20 years ago, but got tired of giving out knives. To be honest, I have not had any issues when I have been stopped carrying, but don't want to run the risk of losing a CCL because I have an illegal knife. I have and carry a TDI when I feel necessary, also have a Cold Steel push knife, but don't carry it because or our laws. I think it is stupid to be able to carry a gun, and not a 5" knife.

PS, sorry, didn't answer your questions. In high school, I was stopped for rolling a stop sign. In Tulsa, I was in a QT getting a drink, the officer approached because of the knife. I was in the parking lot getting into my truck. No citations either time.