Texas allows guns in college classrooms under new law

[MadDogs]

yukonjack has captured my basic thought below.





How many or what percentage are stating a viewpoint? I'd expect most are taking a stance that is consistent with their personal view of the issues of the day. The question really is whether that viewpoint is part of course material or even part of the area of study. If it's really not part of the area of study, then the professor's viewpoint is not germane and can only serve to bias his/her approach to student evaluation. If the course material and area of study actually covers a controversial subject where the professor states a position, I think it should be done in order to generate student interest and discussion that deepens their knowledge of the subject area. The professor's legitimate academic evaluation is then a measurement of the student's ability to conduct academic research that allows the student to state a position that can be supported with evidence and rhetorical skill, not to judge the student against the professor's position with a criteria of right v. wrong.

In my undergrad and graduate studies, I only encountered an absolutely intransigent professor that affected my grade once during undergrad. In my graduate studies, the professors were universally liberal but since I was no longer a callow youth, I was better equipped to stand for my views. I found that my grade was not affected in the least. To keep it in context, the undergrad years were the 1970s and graduate school was early 2000s. I think the academic world has only become much more polarized in the intervening years with adverse effects for students that don't appear to align their views accordingly.

As to the status of the professors in the lawsuit and their approach, I can't say. Perhaps if their names are stated, the RateMyProfessors website could provide some info on how they manage their classroom and grades.

I had the similar experiences in college. I finished grad school in the early 80's and had no issues with my peofessors (including a class in Marxist Economics). But my daughter and son have had the opposite experiences in high school, college and (daughter's) grad work.

 

[MadDogs]

[QUOTE...What policies (plural) does the Republican Party have that are “prejudicial and discriminatory in regard to brown and black people?

I've been watching and waiting for this response as well.

But he responded ... with an emoticon.

Not to defend his response but he may be playing in a hotly contested integrity limbo match with (the late) Lurker66. The emoji was for the win.

To his post on the other thread, he espoused a progressively challenged sans-fact opinion that he likely gleaned from a liberal coloring book. He was politely asked to back up what he said. Fact is he failed to back what he said up. Which brings about the irony that he would actually ask someone to validate a comment when he cannot do the same with his own posts.

People should be free to express opinions of what they believe in any forum. For instance, had he said that "In my opinion the Republican Party platform encourages systemic racism and puppy molestation", that is one thing. But to state "opinion" as a "fact" as he did is another. When one positions their opinion as fact and then fails to back up what they beyond a meme or emoticon, then their posts go in the bucket with the disingenuous and the trolls.

Manage your expectations on his response and temper any retort. Last time I criticized his writing my posts were deleted and I got the ban paddle.

 

[MadDogs]

And that some students will never understand that what their pastor told them doesn't work as a cited source for a topic.

And "some" professors will never understand that people have a Constitutionally protected right to believe and have faith but instead use their position to prosecute instead of grade.

 

[Larry Morgan]

I remember one professor who at first I thought was a jackwagon. He made us read 'The Communist Manifesto'. But I soon realized the book was written, and the beliefs existed whether I liked that or not. Turns out I learned some things from it, and grew as a person.

As I tell everyone going through college, dealing with people who don't share your beliefs is part of your education. If a professor doesn't accept religion or faith in their class, that's just how it is. Not everyone you meet has to accept your beliefs. You came to their class to learn from them. If you don't like what they teach, you can try to argue (and probably lose, since you are likely arguing their expertise), find a different class, find a different school. Or, you can do what we all have to do every day: listen to what they say, understand it, analyze it, and decide if you agree. You just might learn something.

 

[donner]

And "some" professors will never understand that people have a Constitutionally protected right to believe and have faith but instead use their position to prosecute instead of grade.

Well, first, it would probably depend on the instructions for the assignment. If the objective was to find academic sources then failing to do so could result in a penalty.

Next, citing something someone told you is rarely accepted as a source. Even here, the inclination is to ask for a written or otherwise verifiable source for the information because arguing against "well so and so said X to me" isn't provable.

No one disputes their right to their own faith.

 

[MadDogs]

Well, first, it would probably depend on the instructions for the assignment. If the objective was to find academic sources then failing to do so could result in a penalty.

Next, citing something someone told you is rarely accepted as a source. Even here, the inclination is to ask for a written or otherwise verifiable source for the information because arguing against "well so and so said X to me" isn't provable.

No one disputes their right to their own faith.

Your first second points are not the issue. It is the lesson in intolerance one receives when professors that go off on the anti-America or anti-gun or anti-faith or anti-anything rants and where even tacit disagreement results in a penalty.

 

[OKCHunter]

I think the issue is College Professors planning to sue because of the new Texas law. The 2nd Amendment grants the right to keep and bear arms. Therefore, the professors have no basis for bringing a law suit. In fact, I can't see where any gun laws are consistent with our constitutional right.

 

[YukonGlocker]

...Last time I criticized his writing my posts were deleted and I got the ban paddle.

This is a lie. If your posts were deleted and you were banned, it wasn't for criticizing my posts. Criticize my posts all you want...I encourage it. Spread lies and we will have problems.

Not to defend his response but he may be playing in a hotly contested integrity limbo match with (the late) Lurker66. The emoji was for the win.

To his post on the other thread, he espoused a progressively challenged sans-fact opinion that he likely gleaned from a liberal coloring book. He was politely asked to back up what he said. Fact is he failed to back what he said up. Which brings about the irony that he would actually ask someone to validate a comment when he cannot do the same with his own posts.

People should be free to express opinions of what they believe in any forum. For instance, had he said that "In my opinion the Republican Party platform encourages systemic racism and puppy molestation", that is one thing. But to state "opinion" as a "fact" as he did is another. When one positions their opinion as fact and then fails to back up what they beyond a meme or emoticon, then their posts go in the bucket with the disingenuous and the trolls.

Manage your expectations on his response and temper any retort...

1. I'm not in any kind of match with Lurker. I'm not sure where you're going with this, but your assumptions here are totally wrong also.

2. There is a very good reason I haven't responded to the prejudice/discrimination post. Following me all over the forum and posting it in other threads with attempts to get an answer won't help the matter, either. The fact is I'm swamped at work and don't have time to answer it properly. I'll need a minimum of 6-8 paragraphs for a proper response, which I don't have time for right now, and any less is a waste of time. So it will either have to wait until I have time, or it won't be answered.

3. I didn't ask Poke78 to validate anything. I asked him to explain some more so I could understand his position better...and if I understood his position better, I could offer a reply. If he explained more, fine. If he didn't, that's fine too.

What, exactly, do you have a problem with?

 

[donner]

It is the lesson in intolerance one receives when professors that go off on the anti-America or anti-gun or anti-faith or anti-anything rants and where even tacit disagreement results in a penalty.

and as i said, while i've heard stories about it, i've rarely ever seen it happen. And i'm surrounded by a lot of academics. As i said, they often enjoy challenging students to form their own opinions, though. It also probably depends on the school and the demographic makeup of the place. Ole Miss, where we currently live (oxford), has a lot of wealthy students from segregated high schools in jackson, MS. Their world views are much different than the students i met when we lived in Lubbock Texas (Texas Tech).

We can also compare stories of how 'persecuted' students feel when they don't get the grades they 'deserve' (never mind failing to prepare, do assignments or attend class). Recently, one girl went so far as to have her mommy attend the meeting with the professor to protest the unfairness of having class material that came from a source outside the textbook. Never mind that it was presented and covered in class. Others seem to think that not getting an excused absence for a fraternity or sorority function is persecuting them for being part of the Greek life. Lots of hurt feelings can happen through the semester.

I do love the generalizations here, though. 'All professor' this and that. Frankly, most professors i know don't have the time to care about a student's views to be punitive. For many, teaching classes is just what happens between research. Others are more into it, though.

But, I'd suggest anyone who feels they are being persecuted should take steps to document the encounters and approach the department chair and/or dean of the school. If this is truly going on then it's probably a violation of school policies and can be remedied.

 

[MadDogs]

This is a lie. If your posts were deleted and you were banned, it wasn't for criticizing my posts. Criticize my posts all you want...I encourage it. Spread lies and we will have problems.

When you wanted to “bet pay checks” over some nonsensical anti-gun stats you quoted and during the course of the thread I told you to grow up and take a “remedial writing course” … ring a bell? Other than criticizing your prose I have no clue as to why you banned me. Given your lack of response to the “racism” of the Republican platform I guess it was kind of silly of me to expect an explanation.

I'm not in any kind of match with Lurker. I'm not sure where you're going with this, but your assumptions here are totally wrong also.

I was using Lurker as the benchmark to show a lack of credibility and integrity. Thinking about it … you might be right. Lurker would at least try to back his comments up. Now, that said it would typically be in some mutated form of Ebonics but at least he tried to back up what he said.

There is a very good reason I haven't responded to the prejudice/discrimination post.

Because you can’t does come to mind. But feel free to elaborate beyond an emoji.

Following me all over the forum and posting it in other threads with attempts to get an answer won't help the matter, either.

So you do or you don’t mind me “criticizing your posts” all I want?

The fact is I'm swamped at work and don't have time to answer it properly. I'll need a minimum of 6-8 paragraphs for a proper response, which I don't have time for right now, and any less is a waste of time. So it will either have to wait until I have time, or it won't be answered.

Yet you have made six to eight paragraphs in comments and posts since? You made a statement that there is institutionalized racism in the Republican Party. You called people “racists” and your reply is that you don’t have time to explain why?

I didn't ask Poke78 to validate anything. I asked him to explain some more so I could understand his position better...and if I understood his position better, I could offer a reply. If he explained more, fine. If he didn't, that's fine too.

Kind of like what you were asked to do? You were asked to clarify and provide examples. You ran away from that yet you asked others to clarify.

What, exactly, do you have a problem with?

Well, I guess since you asked … when people call other people shrill names like “racist” due to some sans-fact ideological bend it is (to me) problematic. Trying to whiz backwards and say “I don’t have time” to back up my shrill name calling is somewhat amusing more so than problematic.

Let’s go back to the original question. Can you provide two examples of the institutionalized racism of the Republican Party platform? Seriously people "don't know what they don't know" so if you can provide two examples, great. But when you don't ... you probably should expect someone to "criticize" your posts.