Anchovies? You have the right to shoot his car as well.
It'd be a tough sell to think that a pizza dude knocking is reasonably believed to be forcing entry, especially when - again - pizza dude knocked and the door was willfully answered, and Mr. Doe may have been impaired by cold medicines.
To be fair, you asked for objectivity on a very subjective matter
I'm with you in that I think the misunderstanding should be resolved without any charges or adjudication, but I'm also not convinced that a crime didn't technically occur.
Because as soon as you open the door you are no longer in a defensive position, but an aggressive position. Oklahoma's castle doctrine does not extend outside the home. Therefore you have to have an immediate threat to justify deadly force, and someone standing on your porch and banging on the door does not constitute an immediate threat but rather a potential threat. And there is not retreating, you are already behind a closed and (presumably) locked door.
This would be a hard sell. The delivery guy would get on the stand and say he knocked on the door. If thinking that a knock on the door constituted a reasonable belief that someone is trying to break in, there would be several cases of Jehovah Witnesses getting shot through a front door. Since the delivery guy was outside the home, the usual caveats of when you can pull your firearm apply, and quite simply this scenario doesn't have them. Mr. Doe was not in imminent danger (the DG was still outside, door was closed). He could not see if anyone else was in imminent danger. The only thing Mr. Doe has in his defense is he thought someone might be trying to break in. That won't hold in court. Unless it was a Jehovah Witness that is (I kid!).
The argument that self-defense is presumed when there’s a reasonable belief that someone broke in or is attempting to break in to a castle is perfectly valid, in general. But it’s going to be hard to argue that in this case. The last thing a person does when they think someone’s breaking down their door is open it. I don’t doubt he was legitimately afraid, but his actions seem to betray the idea that he reasonably believed there was a break-in occurring.
I’ll echo @Cards81fan’s sentiment that charges shouldn’t be brought though. Given the circumstances that both parties were partially to blame and no one was hurt, it’s hard to see how justice would be furthered by prosecuting. Writing that gives me pause because a use of deadly force (which this was) should never be brushed aside lightly. But as I see it, banging loudly on someone’s door after dark is a pretty serious situation. I can easily empathize with Doe being afraid in this situation, and he shouldn’t suffer legal consequences for a technical violation where no one was harmed.
I’ll echo @Cards81fan’s sentiment that charges shouldn’t be brought though. Given the circumstances that both parties were partially to blame and no one was hurt, it’s hard to see how justice would be furthered by prosecuting. Writing that gives me pause because a use of deadly force (which this was) should never be brushed aside lightly. But as I see it, banging loudly on someone’s door after dark is a pretty serious situation. I can easily empathize with Doe being afraid in this situation, and he shouldn’t suffer legal consequences for a technical violation where no one was harmed.
I will disagree with this part. Yes, Mr. Doe was not expecting someone, but the delivery guy was expecting someone to be expecting him. I always knock pretty hard on my customer's door, regardless of the time. This is because many times I may knock with what I think is enough force to be heard, and its not. So I exaggerate it to make sure. I also have to knock on doors of people NOT expecting me (when I have to gain entry to their yard to get to a cable ped). I knock with the same force, for the same reason. I also step back about 3 feet from the door so people can see me plainly. So, even though it was dark, its easy to see why the DG would knock loudly.
Did Mr. Doe make a mistake? Yes. Was it his intention to break the law? Probably not. But the fact is he went outside the boundaries set forth by the SDA. As his act was one not done out of malice I don't want him to be charged with anything that will take away his 2nd amendment rights, but he needs to go over the SDA with an instructor and relearn when someone can deploy deadly force.
I am not an attorney, but I have worked with criminal statutes when I was at the OSBI. With that said, I have to agree that the homeowner negated the break-in aspect simply because he opened the door. In some senses, and a DA could go this route, it was almost like the homeowner was "inviting" the person outside by opening the door.
If there had been an actual shooting, I feel confident that the homeowner would have been charged with murder.
The differences between the misdemeanor and felony statues for "pointing a weapon" is that a misdemeanor occurs when one accidentally points the weapon and a felony when they intentionally point it.
If there had been an actual shooting, I feel confident that the homeowner would have been charged with murder.
The differences between the misdemeanor and felony statues for "pointing a weapon" is that a misdemeanor occurs when one accidentally points the weapon and a felony when they intentionally point it.
IMO, he should have never opened the door. He should have yelled out who is there and see if they answered. If no answer, call police and get into a defensive position. If someone does break in, he is free and clear to use deadly force. As soon as he opened the door however, he can not justify deadly force as he walked out of safety and forced the confrontation.
I may be imagining a more violent banging based on the OP’s story.
I agree he should be reviewing § 1289 et al thoroughly after this. It’s something we all should do regularly, especially with how relatively frequently it changes.
It'd be a tough sell to think that a pizza dude knocking is reasonably believed to be forcing entry, especially when - again - pizza dude knocked and the door was willfully answered, and Mr. Doe may have been impaired by cold medicines.
To be fair, you asked for objectivity on a very subjective matter
And I thank you for your objective and honest answers. I’m just trying to make sure that I’m not too close to the situation and that I’m not ignoring any potential blind spots. If this thing goes to court, I want to make sure that I’ve gotten in front of as many lines of prosecutorial attack as I possibly can. The DA is taking a hard line, so it very well may see a jury.
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