Civilized Man May Soon Revile Abortion as it Does Slavery

Tanis143 · May 2, 2019

Ethan N said:
I believe sex other than between a man and woman married to each other is sin,

This is your belief, but that belief should not be taught in schools. I'm ok with teaching abstinence is the only 100% way to prevent pregnancy and STDs (because its true), but that should be followed up with teaching if you DO have sex, use protection. I'm not of the Christian faith, therefor I believe sex between two (or more) willing partners is fine. If its just sex for the sake of sex with someone other than a long time partner, you need protection from both STD's and pregnancy (where it applies). That is what should be taught in schools.

Ethan N · May 2, 2019

Tanis143 said:
This is your belief, but that belief should not be taught in schools. I'm ok with teaching abstinence is the only 100% way to prevent pregnancy and STDs (because its true), but that should be followed up with teaching if you DO have sex, use protection. I'm not of the Christian faith, therefor I believe sex between two (or more) willing partners is fine. If its just sex for the sake of sex with someone other than a long time partner, you need protection from both STD's and pregnancy (where it applies). That is what should be taught in schools.

I’m not in the business of forcing my religion’s morality on people who aren’t believers. In fact, I believe the Bible teaches that would be futile.

C_Hallbert · May 3, 2019

donner said:
even if conception was forced, with a relative or continuation might kill the woman?

Hmmmm.....

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donner · May 3, 2019

C_Hallbert said:
Hmmmm.....

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i only asked because i believe some of the 'new' abortion restrictions (such as in alabama) do not make any exceptions for rape or incest. And i personally know someone who had to terminate a baby because it was an ectopic pregnancy, which would have likely killed her. She was understandably heartbroken, but you get the idea.

Ethan N · May 3, 2019

donner said:
i only asked because i believe some of the 'new' abortion restrictions (such as in alabama) do not make any exceptions for rape or incest.

I believe children who were conceived through rape and incest are just as valuable as children who weren’t. It’s a great tragedy for the mother, but being the victim of a crime does not justify facilitating another crime. And regardless of what the law says, abortion is a crime.

donner said:
And i personally know someone who had to terminate a baby because it was an ectopic pregnancy, which would have likely killed her. She was understandably heartbroken, but you get the idea.

Ectopic pregnancy is a special case not relevant to the discussion of abortion in general because…

the mother and child are both practically certain to die without intervention (“the principle of double effect”),
the only interventions currently available that have any real chance of saving either the mother or the child can only save the mother,
the intended effect of the intervention is not the death of the child, and
the intervention is not an abortion procedure, but rather a surgical removal of one or more of the mother’s organs.

For those reasons, ectopic pregnancy is a very different issue (and procedure) than abortion, and I do not agree with criminalizing treatment for ectopic pregnancy even when the child dies as a result (though my wife and I are on the fence as far as whether that’s what we would choose).

Other than ectopic pregnancy, “health of the mother” exceptions are mostly BS loopholes that let people perform illegal abortions because the mother has a mere 0.0056644% chance of dying because of the pregnancy[source], and only half that chance of dying due to an unpreventable cause[source]. Her chances of dying in a car accident are higher, so unless she’s willing to forgo automotive travel as well as a bunch of other activities that she engages in that are much more risky than pregnancy and childbirth, I don’t think she has a legitimate fear for her health that overcomes the right of the child to live.

BReeves · May 4, 2019

You can't legislate morality, abortions are going to happen regardless. The real question is are they going to happen in a back ally with a coat hanger or in a hospital.

MacFromOK · May 4, 2019

BReeves said:
You can't legislate morality, abortions are going to happen regardless. The real question is are they going to happen in a back ally with a coat hanger or in a hospital.

Robbery and murder are going to happen regardless ('cause you can't legislate morality), but we don't make 'em legal.

Well... except for abortion.
:drunk2:

TerryMiller · May 4, 2019

BReeves said:
You can't legislate morality, abortions are going to happen regardless. The real question is are they going to happen in a back ally with a coat hanger or in a hospital.

I read somewhere that the procedures you refer to in the back alley happened a lot less than people are led to believe.

Ethan N · May 4, 2019

MacFromOK said:
Robbery and murder are going to happen regardless ('cause you can't legislate morality), but we don't make 'em legal.

Well... except for abortion.

Logical consistency is not popular among those who want abortion to be legal.

ignerntbend · May 6, 2019

TerryMiller said:
I read somewhere that the procedures you refer to in the back alley happened a lot less than people are led to believe.

Duh. When abortion is safe and legal, you don't have the back alley stuff. I read that somewhere. Nobody should hold me responsible for anything I claim to have read.

Civilized Man May Soon Revile Abortion as it Does Slavery

Tanis143

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Ethan N

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Ethan N

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