FYI- Traffic Stops

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Fyrtwuck

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Mentioning the second amendment brought back a memory. It was back in the eighties that I stopped a guy driving a Toyota pickup for speeding. Normally what happens in a traffic stop is the driver waits for the officer to approach the vehicle and make contact. This time the driver got out at the same time I did.

This is when a warning bell goes off. It’s been my experience that the driver has something in the vehicle they don’t want to see and they think they can avoid this by meeting the officer halfway. Or, the person has been stopped by OHP, which at the time they would have the driver sit beside them in the Troopers car. I don’t know if that is still their policy or not.

I make contact and ask for his DL. He hands it to me. Then I ask for his Insurance Verification. He tells me it’s in the glove compartment of his truck. I tell him to go get it. As we are walking toward the passenger side of the truck, I see him glancing over his left shoulder as if he’s trying to see where I am. The warning bell just got louder.

He uses his keys to open the door and as he’s doing so, his attention is diverted and I shift my position to his right toward the front of his truck. When he opened the door I saw a shotgun lying on the front seat. He opened the glove compartment and the same time he looked to where he thought I was and was shocked that I wasn’t there.

I ordered him to step to the rear and put his hands on the tailgate and don’t move. He did. I checked the shotgun to see if it was loaded and it wasn’t. As I was walking back to my car I told him that it was in his best interest to tell me if he had a gun in the vehicle. I asked if he had any other weapons or anything he needed to tell me and he said no.

I went back to my car and ran my usual radio inquires and didn’t find any suspensions, warrants or prior criminal history. I wrote my ticket and walked back to where he was still standing. I started my usual speech “I need your signature on this citation, it’s not an admission of guilt,”. it’s a promise....and this is when he started with his prepared speech.

“You can’t issue me a citation, I have a second amendment right to keep and bear arms and I can carry an unloaded firearm to and from a range, I am carrying that gun legally”..........I stopped him there. I said “Hey! This hasn’t got dick to do with your second amendment rights or the shotgun, this is a speeding ticket!” He said “oh” in a much lower voice. He signed the ticket and I never saw or heard from him again.
 

RKM

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I am surprised that my comments are somehow anti law enforcement when they were all about your civil rights at a traffic stop. No presenting drivers license or ccw was never mentioned. My point was that it was unlawful to ask the passenger for id. Video taping is lawful and keeps all parties accountable. If it pisses the cop off so be it. There should be no reason whatsoever for a police officer or trooper to be upset over cameras. They tape us we tape them. It seems alot if people are afraid to exercise their rights guaranteed by our Constitution. All encounters that I have taped the officer didn't get angry one bit....but if he did, too bad. That is my right to do so. We exercise our second Amendment all the time, but seem to hestitate on the others for fear of upsetting LEO's.

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ignerntbend

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I am surprised that my comments are somehow anti law enforcement when they were all about your civil rights at a traffic stop. No presenting drivers license or ccw was never mentioned. My point was that it was unlawful to ask the passenger for id. Video taping is lawful and keeps all parties accountable. If it pisses the cop off so be it. There should be no reason whatsoever for a police officer or trooper to be upset over cameras. They tape us we tape them. It seems alot if people are afraid to exercise their rights guaranteed by our Constitution. All encounters that I have taped the officer didn't get angry one bit....but if he did, too bad. That is my right to do so. We exercise our second Amendment all the time, but seem to hestitate on the others for fear of upsetting LEO's.

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Ten years ago, you could have been banned from OSA for expressing this perfectly reasonable opinion, and justifying it so well.
 

Snattlerake

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I am surprised that my comments are somehow anti law enforcement when they were all about your civil rights at a traffic stop. No presenting drivers license or ccw was never mentioned. My point was that it was unlawful to ask the passenger for id. Video taping is lawful and keeps all parties accountable. If it pisses the cop off so be it. There should be no reason whatsoever for a police officer or trooper to be upset over cameras. They tape us we tape them. It seems alot if people are afraid to exercise their rights guaranteed by our Constitution. All encounters that I have taped the officer didn't get angry one bit....but if he did, too bad. That is my right to do so. We exercise our second Amendment all the time, but seem to hestitate on the others for fear of upsetting LEO's.

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True statements all.
 

Fyrtwuck

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I am surprised that my comments are somehow anti law enforcement when they were all about your civil rights at a traffic stop. No presenting drivers license or ccw was never mentioned. My point was that it was unlawful to ask the passenger for id. Video taping is lawful and keeps all parties accountable. If it pisses the cop off so be it. There should be no reason whatsoever for a police officer or trooper to be upset over cameras. They tape us we tape them. It seems alot if people are afraid to exercise their rights guaranteed by our Constitution. All encounters that I have taped the officer didn't get angry one bit....but if he did, too bad. That is my right to do so. We exercise our second Amendment all the time, but seem to hestitate on the others for fear of upsetting LEO's.

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In my opinion, what happens when someone in today’s culture starts shoving a camera in an officers face and repeatedly says “I’m recording you” and “I don’t answer any question” they are purposefully trying to bait the officer into being more defensive as they already are. They are trying to solicit a reaction that will discredit the officer for their own entertainment or followers on YouTube.

Think from the officers side. I used to get asked why I was defensive in my contacts on every traffic stop. My reply was “I’m pulling over a car occupied with people I know knowing about. For all I know it could be Charlie Manson and some of his followers just waiting to ambush me at the first opportunity.”

So, yeah, shove a camera in their faces, act suspiciously and the officers defensive scale goes up a few notches and they are paranoid about what and when this person is going to do next.
 

RKM

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I get it. What I don't get is where in the hell do you guys come up with this "shove a camera in the cop's face"? I said I use my dash cam. Now let's look at the car full of people that you have pulled over. Only the driver has broken a traffic law. According to state law, only the driver has to present his driver's license and identify himself, not anyone else. No matter how bad you want to ID everyone, in order for you to honor your oath and the Constitution they should not even be asked. Let's talk about suspicion. What constitutes that? I realize a cop has to go with his gut but is suspicion a crime? If that were a legal precedent police should be going door to door searching every home because at one time in their lives people gave acted suspicious. Believe me, I have close relatives that are cops or have been cops and we have some interesting discussions. But the nut cut of it is the Constitution of the United States. Something every police officer has to swear to uphold and what civilians expect them to uphold. It's sad in today's society that people are more afraid of police than they are criminals. Watch Live PD and some of the troopers that stop someone for a minor traffic infractions wind up getting searched and handcuffed for "officer safety". Sorry, when I get pulled over I want to know what I did wrong, provide my papers, get my ticket and be on my way without the 21 question rountine.

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DavidMcmillan

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LivePD is hardly the basis for any serious conversation.

The middle of a busy street, day or night, is not the place to test anyone's knowledge of the Constitution. Those very rare situations where something is done incorrectly can be corrected before a judge, using your oun lawyer who probably understands the law much better than his client.
 

SPDguns

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I get it. What I don't get is where in the hell do you guys come up with this "shove a camera in the cop's face"? I said I use my dash cam. Now let's look at the car full of people that you have pulled over. Only the driver has broken a traffic law. According to state law, only the driver has to present his driver's license and identify himself, not anyone else. No matter how bad you want to ID everyone, in order for you to honor your oath and the Constitution they should not even be asked. Let's talk about suspicion. What constitutes that? I realize a cop has to go with his gut but is suspicion a crime? If that were a legal precedent police should be going door to door searching every home because at one time in their lives people gave acted suspicious. Believe me, I have close relatives that are cops or have been cops and we have some interesting discussions. But the nut cut of it is the Constitution of the United States. Something every police officer has to swear to uphold and what civilians expect them to uphold. It's sad in today's society that people are more afraid of police than they are criminals. Watch Live PD and some of the troopers that stop someone for a minor traffic infractions wind up getting searched and handcuffed for "officer safety". Sorry, when I get pulled over I want to know what I did wrong, provide my papers, get my ticket and be on my way without the 21 question rountine.

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Just curious, what do you do for a living?
 

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