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223 Rem brass prep evaluation and some plain ol fun

Discussion in 'Ammo & Reloading' started by Hunter'sWorld, Nov 30, 2016.

  1. Hunter'sWorld

    Hunter'sWorld Sharpshooter

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    Finally had the chance to go to the range and practice with a red dot I have not spent much time with. It's a 2MOA, and I took a buck with it a couple weeks ago. It's true place is on top of my AR15.

    I was trying to accomplish two things.
    1. Will my 1/9 twist barrel shoot 62 gn bullets respectably
    2. Evaluate case prep
    DISCLAIMER: after sighting in, I shot only one 5 shot group. What you see is that one group, not the best out of several groups.

    Goal 1. 5 shot group at 50yards with AE 62gn FMJBT ammo.
    All shot were taken relatively quickly (i'd approximate 30 sec for 5 rounds)
    photo 1.JPG
    Im shooting about 2MOA. How am I doing?

    Goal 2. 4-5 shot groups at 50 yards with brass that @swampratt supplied (see piece of pictures for more details). All loads were 22g of Varget behind a 62gn FBHP. All shot were taken relatively quickly (i'd approximate 30 sec for 5 rounds).
    photo 2-2.JPG photo 1-1.JPG photo 3.JPG photo 4.JPG photo 2-1.JPG

    there are 4 shots in the first pic of that series
    The major lesson that I learned is .... sort brass by headstamp!
    More testing to be done for sure.

    A big thanks to you @swampratt, for your effort.

    One questions that lingers in my mind (honestly)... how much better should I be shooting with a red dot? I need to take longer shots but I am guessing that 2MOA is probably the best I will get with a 2MOA red dot. Or am I selling the red dot and the rifle short? feedback encouraged :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2016
  2. grwd

    grwd Sharpshooter

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    2" is pretty good. Your probably at the limit of your optic. If you want the most out of a dot, accuracy wise, turn the illumination down low and use the TOP of the dot as an aiming point, not the whole dot.
     
    dennishoddy likes this.
  3. swampratt

    swampratt Sharpshooter

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    Good shooting really for a dot sight.
    What i found when shooting for really tight groups is what grwd is getting at.
    Do NOT cover the specific aim point or say target center with the dot.

    Say you have an X on the papet do not cover the x with the dot.. just place the very edge of the dot on top of the X or bottom of the X.
    With a dot I would probably draw some thick lined circles on paper. say 1/4" to 1/2" wide sharpie.
    I would place my dot inside the circle.. try to get it evenly set.

    Brass prep and sorting sure shows in your groups.
    Kind of an eye opener isn't it.

    I have been looking at a different scope recently for my .223 a 2.5-10x42... I like the idea of the small power side for larger FOV area.
    But I still want some power when needed
     
  4. Hunter'sWorld

    Hunter'sWorld Sharpshooter

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    Thank you for the tip about using the top (or edge) of the RD. Makes sense.

    This exercise really was an eyeopener for me. Ive got sorting to do.
    Next step is to try different powders and charges behind 62gn bullets.
     
  5. swampratt

    swampratt Sharpshooter

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    Want to really blow your mind start shooting at different distances with different loads.
    I have some loads that are my 50 yard loads for my .308.
    Then there are loads that look excellent at 100 yards under, .25" many times .. but that load goes to crap at 200 yards.. lucky to keep it on an 8x11.5 paper.
    Then there is my go to load for hunting .75" at 100 yards..Not impressive.. but it shoots that same small group at 200.

    So the moral of the story is. Do not settle on a load that looks good at 50 or 100 if you plan on shooting it at different distances.

    And try your loads at cold temps, like below freezing and also at higher temps ..around 70.. see if the load stays together.
    I had some varget loads and 60gr bullets and 69gr bullets that looked awesome at temps around 20f.
    get up to 70-88 and they were horrible.. from all touching to all in a 2".

    Not horrible if 2" will get the job done.
     
  6. swampratt

    swampratt Sharpshooter

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    HA! Then about the time you figure out the load you love the powder runs out and you get a different batch number.
    Or the bullet batch number is different and there is a slight change.
    Back to chasing your tail.

    I like powder in 8lb jugs or get a case of the 1 lb bottles all same batch number.
    100 box of bullets to me is a waste of time and money..I buy in 100 count boxes but I like to get 300 or more if funds allow it all in the same batch number.
    Depending on how much I plan on shooting.
    I have many bullets that I have 800 of the same batch number.. figure that should last a bit.

    Prep that many pieces of brass all the same takes some time.
     
  7. Hunter'sWorld

    Hunter'sWorld Sharpshooter

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    I did not know how the rifle would handle the 62gn's so I bought 100 bullets. Next purchase will be 500-1000.
    Am gonna do the same thing for 68-69gn bullets, but i imagine a 1/7 twist barrel will do better with those.

    In always assumed that the load that does well at 100 also will do well at 200, 500, and 50.
    I've never payed enough attention to that though.
    I will also have to keep the temperature phenomenon in mind.
     
  8. swampratt

    swampratt Sharpshooter

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    Every gun I have had wanted the long skinny bullets pushed fast to be most accurate. usually max book or past that.

    I have some 69gr TMK bullets my 1/9 shoots them ok not excellent.
    I will give you 50 of them if you want to try them out.

    I seen a few 1/7 twist barrels that just loved the 55gr bullets.

    Now as you have seen if brass prep or head stamp is not the same you could think the gun just does not like the bullet when in fact it is not the bullet at fault.
    My 55gr load shoots 3/4" at 100, sometimes tighter sometimes larger. At 200 it looks really good.
    55gr V-max.

    Now here is something to do.
    Calculate the speed of the 62 or larger weight bullet.. know the bullet BC.. now find the BC of a smaller 55gr and the speed at which it flies.
    Compare the 2 at the range you plan on shooting.
    I got all tied up in high BC bullets and began shooting at longer distances.. the high BC heavy bullet did not shoot near as flat.
    Wind drift between the 55 and 69 were nu-noticable.

    Handloading is fun,, you try all kinds of stuff before you settle on a load so be ready.
    I tried 4 different bullets, 4 makes of brass and 3 powders before I got a happy load.
     
  9. Larry Morgan

    Larry Morgan Sharpshooter

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    69gr with 1:9 is going to start depending a lot on what velocity you achieve out the barrel. It's about spin speed vs bullet length. If the bullet length goes up, so must spin speed. To get spin speed up, you have to push the bullet harder to up velocity, or make the twist rate faster.

    69gr SMK is probably your best bet. It took me awhile before I could get 68gr HPBT from Hornady to straighten out in 1:9 because it's noticeably longer than the SMK. I have to push them near max, which means 2800+fps out of a 24" barrel and 30gr of RL-15.
     
  10. Hunter'sWorld

    Hunter'sWorld Sharpshooter

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    Interesting. I've got some research to do, but now I know what to look for. Thanks.
     

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