5 Clues that Training is Not Realistic

[Leadblooded]

However they're far from unbreakable.
Michael Brown

Nothing's unbreakable, I don't care how good it is, their will always be someone bigger, or badder, or better trained than you to prove it. This is why we train to retain. Holsters are just one aspect, you've got to get it into yourself that you will not be defeated and work towards that purpose.Even if it means, (and I know the chance is slim with all these shooters on board) that I am bare-knuckled and you are armed, I can see the chink in your armor.
I =being the goodguy
You =being the badguy

 

[IDtheTarget]

ID, he did on the first page of the thread.

Whups, you're right. I thought I'd read the whole thread, and I hadn't.

Thank you, Michael, you've obviously got light-year's more experience than I and I can see that I need to seriously re-think my holster and retention strategies.

 

[Michael Brown]

Whups, you're right. I thought I'd read the whole thread, and I hadn't.

Thank you, Michael, you've obviously got light-year's more experience than I and I can see that I need to seriously re-think my holster and retention strategies.

While I greatly appreciate the kudos, the big deal really isn't the experience as there are plenty of folks more experienced than me.

What tends to distinguish what my group does is that we do the work on a regular basis. I.E. we train at least twice a week on physical strategies and techniques against live, resisting opponents.

Most people (instructors included) usually work against cardboard or compliant or minimally resistant opponents.

That's the big difference. I just get to see and experience a lot firsthand because I'm willing to do the work.

Anyone, who is willing, can do what I do. Its just that there aren't too many people willing to sweat and bleed to do it and that's really what's required.

I heard a good theory from Tuhon Tom Kier of Sayoc Kali a couple weeks ago at a seminar: Take two identical twins and tell them they're going to fight each other six months from now.

Number 1 will get fifty of the best coaches/instructors in the world and they will train him in the best techniques in the world for that six months. They are going to teach him until he has the techniques down pat and he will know the proper way to throw punches, kicks, etc.

Number 2 will get fifty guys with headgear and boxing gloves and he will fight them five days a week for six months. They won't teach him a single technique but merely fight during all his sessions.

At the end of six months, number 2 will trash number 1.

While I believe a balance of the two is the best option, how much training that anyone has done involves the prospect of pain?

Certainly shooting cardboard doesn't do that and that's why so many seemingly trained people are really unprepared for conflict.

All realistic training programs have two things:

1) The prospect of failure

2) The prosepect of danger/pain

Nothing is a guarantee to combat success but training as close as possible to realistic conditions is the best bet you can make.

When you train realistically (i.e. against resistant opponents who try to hurt you) people invariably come to the same conclusions.

This is one of the reasons that two instructors, like myself and Southnarc as of a few years ago, can never train together and come up with incredibly similar programs and ideas.

When you actually do the work, the answers become self-evident. Like I said before, anyone can do what I do. All I do is try to apply an analytical mind and then actually sweat and bleed while doing the work.

Michael Brown

 

[okbirdman]

One of the most important lessons we learned in the Marine Corps is "that it

is better to sweat in peace than bleed in war", unfortunately I was a slow

learner twice. But I will agree that real life scenarios and true training are the

best education a person can have. Unfortunately to many people believe that

an 8 hour class and 50 rounds down range are going to save their life. In my

experience you will never be totally prepared for any type of confrontation,

but training and a clear mind will save your life. IMO true training is the only

way to maintain a clear head in combat. I believe this comes far above what

type of holster should I wear, I believe that you should wear what works best

for you provided it is a quality product, and don't have a diferent holster for every

day of the week. And always train in the exact equipment you are going to use

when your life depends on it. Now I am no expert, just someone with a few real life

experiences to draw from, and is always continuing his education and training

for personal gain.

 

[KurtM]

Quickest way I know how to tell if your training isn't realistic, is when the instructor says "In the real world".

 

[Serenity Bushcraft]

Michael,
I use a Blackhawk CQC holster and it is Kydex and also has a retention device that grabs the front of thr trigger guard. It is an OWB holster and is perfectly suited to CC in the cooler months when I wear a jacket. I also had one of these holsters that has stood up to 2 deployments to Iraq in some brutal conditions. It never broke, loosened, and I never once lost a handgun. I am sure that your knowledge is unlimited in both the training and shooting arts. H2H weapon retention is something that we all need to be able to do. But you stated above the if your gear can not take a hit from an NFL linebacker then it is not up to the task. I am here to inform you that the flesh and bone that i am constructed of will most deffently not withstand such abuse. So the most vital component of my self defense is therfore bypassed before I get the chance to shoot. I understand the analogy quite well though. Your gear has to be tough. CHEERS, notasniper

 

[Michael Brown]

Michael,
I use a Blackhawk CQC holster and it is Kydex and also has a retention device that grabs the front of thr trigger guard. It is an OWB holster and is perfectly suited to CC in the cooler months when I wear a jacket. I also had one of these holsters that has stood up to 2 deployments to Iraq in some brutal conditions. It never broke, loosened, and I never once lost a handgun. I am sure that your knowledge is unlimited in both the training and shooting arts. H2H weapon retention is something that we all need to be able to do. But you stated above the if your gear can not take a hit from an NFL linebacker then it is not up to the task. I am here to inform you that the flesh and bone that i am constructed of will most deffently not withstand such abuse. So the most vital component of my self defense is therfore bypassed before I get the chance to shoot. I understand the analogy quite well though. Your gear has to be tough. CHEERS, notasniper

If it works for you, cool.

You're the only one who has to wear it and deal with it's strengths and weaknesses.

Michael Brown

 

[marine0331usmc]

Michael ,

I totally agree with you on the real world training. OHP's Defensive Tactics program has gone to this real world attacker based training. We use High gear suits and red trainer guns to train. It's eye opening when a maniac has smacked you over and over trying to take your life. People don't realize that and think punching paper is the end all be all of self defense. They are sadly mistaken. We at OHP are using a safariland 6360 ALS level III holster for duty carry which works fine, but also like you I don't like the concealed carry equivalent. I also like the Milt Sparks Summer special II and as an OWB Carry I use a Galco Silhouette High ride holster when I go to church or someplace where I am setting for prolong periods of time. I carry a Glock 31 which is approved by the department. I attended DT Instructor school last year and had my arm broken during a drill. Real world training. I plan to return and finish in 2012. I train regularly with two of my brothers who are P.D. Officers at a local Police and we have a man who is a high black belt in karate and ju-jitsu who comes and trains as well as some other officers on a weekly basis. We do duty belt drills where an attacker comes while wearing a duty belt.Then we do Concealed carry holster drills full speed. Bumps, bruises, and black eyes are usually handed out.We also achieve real world training and a lesson. Michael It's awesome you preach these principles. I appreciate what folks like you do.

"Siq Vis Paquem Parabellum" - "If you want peace, Prepare for war."

 

[SPDguns]

Interesting thread. It is also true that an unarmed determined man can easily kill a well armed unprepred man.

 

[Redriverboy]

so if I was looking for a real trainer who would I go to in southern Oklahoma ive heard of a place in grandfield ok, that's supposed to be good I cant remember the name of it though