ATF to reclassify AR and AK pistols as AOW’s!!!

[dennishoddy]

My point was that the NRA was trashed before any other gun friendly organization was given the time to respond.
The GOA in your link only reported the action taken by the ATF. They did not say what their platform was to respond to it.
The NRA has also responded with the same format.
No defined legal response to the ruling. https://www.nraila.org/articles/202...rbitrary-determination-on-honey-badger-pistol
In honesty, its probably too early for either of them to file any legal response. We will just have to sit back and see who uses our money to our advantage.

 

[Fredkrueger100]

Id like to believe the NRA and some 2A friendly organizations will step up to the plate soon. I could be wrong though.

The ONLY ones likely to do anything are the GOA and FPC. The. NRA won’t do squat. I’m sure Wayne had already made that decision. He will
Meet with Trump to make some more back door deals for us to be sold out on. I’m Trumps recent interview he spoke very highly of Wayne. That should give great concern to every pro 2A person. Wayne is an enemy of the 2A and Trump loves him. It’s no wonder why Trump has been so bad on the 2A. But hey, many people keep believing him when he says “I will always protect the 2A”. His actions have spoken far louder.

 

[Fredkrueger100]

For the love of God, let the bumpstock thing go. It's not even remotely the same. The bumpstock was not a gun. It was classified an accessory. Keep reminding them how easy it is to get rid of accessories. You know the SCOTUS ruled that suppressors are accessories too.

No I won’t let it go. What was done was unconstitutional. Yes it was an accessory. An accessory that they now consider a machine gun part. It was NEVER about the bumpstock. It was about how the ban was done. It set a dangerous precedent for future bans. Millions of people became felons overnight. They had three choices. Either destroy it or send it in to be destroyed with ZERO compensation, pay the $200 tax to register it under the NFA, or keep it and risk being caught. If you want to act like it’s not a big deal then go right ahead. You are wrong. It’s a very big deal. Just look up military arms channels video on it for a different perspective.

 

[TedKennedy]

No I won’t let it go. What was done was unconstitutional. Yes it was an accessory. An accessory that they now consider a machine gun part. It was NEVER about the bumpstock. It was about how the ban was done. It set a dangerous precedent for future bans. Millions of people became felons overnight. They had three choices. Either destroy it or send it in to be destroyed with ZERO compensation, pay the $200 tax to register it under the NFA, or keep it and risk being caught. If you want to act like it’s not a big deal then go right ahead. You are wrong. It’s a very big deal. Just look up military arms channels video on it for a different perspective.

I wish like hell every gun owner and every so-called gun advocate took this position.

 

[PBramble]

The precedent set for future bans includes accessories. It does not include firearms. The fed. gov. can make no rules banning firearms. There's a paper on it and a SCOTUS in the way of it. The bump stock is not a machine gun part. It doesn't fit the definition. If it did, binary triggers would be illegal too. Fortunately, the sky is not falling, it's only rain. As for every so called gun advocate taking this position, some tend to be rational and focus on the important stuff, like reigning in the organization and people responsible, not choosing to die on bumpstock hill.

As a side note, and EO can not be used for gun control. THAT's unconstitutional. If you follow it, that's up to you.
As a further side note, I've said this before elsewhere, I don't get my news from Youtube. When there is irrefutable proof in the form of an official release, I'll read it and see what it actually says. Youtubers make money from clicks. Create panic and you get more clicks. Then you end up with a bunch of ill informed people spewing untrue diatribe across the web and riling others further. Wait until the facts are out. If it turns out to be true, you can tell me I told you so.

 

[rc508pir]

The precedent set for future bans includes accessories. It does not include firearms. The fed. gov. can make no rules banning firearms. There's a paper on it and a SCOTUS in the way of it. The bump stock is not a machine gun part. It doesn't fit the definition. If it did, binary triggers would be illegal too. Fortunately, the sky is not falling, it's only rain. As for every so called gun advocate taking this position, some tend to be rational and focus on the important stuff, like reigning in the organization and people responsible, not choosing to die on bumpstock hill.

As a side note, and EO can not be used for gun control. THAT's unconstitutional. If you follow it, that's up to you.
As a further side note, I've said this before elsewhere, I don't get my news from Youtube. When there is irrefutable proof in the form of an official release, I'll read it and see what it actually says. Youtubers make money from clicks. Create panic and you get more clicks. Then you end up with a bunch of ill informed people spewing untrue diatribe across the web and riling others further. Wait until the facts are out. If it turns out to be true, you can tell me I told you so.

As the saying goes, "Nip it at the bud" Stop it before it becomes official. Once it becomes official It will usually take the courts 3 to 5 years to render it "UnConstitutional"

 

[PBramble]

Feel free to read up on the letters the ATF are sending. I agree Youtubers make money via clicks, though this is a real issue brought to the surface by the youtube community and Q specifically.

Wiley Law is a firm that deal heavily in firearms.
https://comms.wiley.law/8/3583/octo....asp?sid=a452ea75-2271-421a-8974-669a79e41dc6

From the article you linked. It's literally in the first sentence. Why is this part escaping everyone. Read it over until understanding what it says. I even highlighted the important part. MAC and others are using old NRA scare tactics to boost sensationalism. Stop getting "official" information at the local diner from the old guys around the big table. And ATF hasn't released anything official on this yet.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) has recently changed the manner in which it interprets the statutory and regulatory definition of “handgun,” thereby further limiting the types of firearms eligible for importation.

 

[PBramble]

The HB is a whole different matter. It doesn't relate to this. This is about reclassifying pistols for importation. And I did read it. The letter goes on to state "there may be changes". It does not say everybody's a felon immediately because we changed a ruling on imported goods. Those who are the most vocal seem to be the least read up on the matter. So, you've read the letter. You watched a youtube channel on it. What does the official release from the ATF say? When that question can be answered, the topic can be further discussed. But since there's no release from them, it's really a moot point. I am currently having this discussion on another board full of people that actually work for government agencies that are privy to what is happening. That doesn't make me an expert on it, it just gives me a differing view point than what I'm seeing here.

 

[PBramble]

The ATF said the Q Honey Badger was no longer a pistol but an SBR. They then released a 60 day stay (after the election) and will provide clarification on the issue. These are two facts that occurred. The Honey Badger being a USA made product and not imported creates a problem with your statement of being entirely based on the change in importation. After Q released the ATF cease and desist letter to the public due to the lack of response from the ATF the other issues have come about. ATF made a ruling that civilians could purchase the Q Honey Badger with a pistol brace as a pistol. They later retracted that and changed the classification of the pistol to an NFA item. Those that have the Honey Badger with a pistol brace now have an unregistered NFA item. When you posses an unregistered NFA item it is a felony. Even the the possession of the entire items disassembled shows intent to manufacture an unregistered NFA item, which is also illegal.

The law review shows how quickly the ATF can and are looking at changing the term Pistol to look at each individual item with objective features. Home built pistol braced firearms would need to be sent to the ATF for verification of them not being an NFA item. I believe they will provide some amount of time, as they did with the bump stocks, to remove or destroy said items. I personally don't have much trust for the government when it comes to doing the anything ethically correct.

Being somewhat versed on NFA items, its a very sticky situation for over 4M people with pistol braces on AR pistols, AK pistols, HK pistols, or any firearm that does not preclude itself from being classified as an NFA item. If the ATF is going to change the definition of Pistols to NFA items on a whim it, anyone with a pistol braced firearm is in jeopardy of committing a felony under the NFA act.

If you choose to not understand or see what is happening that is your prerogative. The issue is a real one, and waiting to hear from the ATF is not very strategic. We should all write our senators, congressmen, and governors objecting to the move from the ATF. If the ATF does act, it will take years to fight the legal battle.

Since you seem versed in the HB case, you also know that the ATF measured it incorrectly and basically has to redo their assessment, in addition to the letter they received. You're also aware the ATF doesn't make laws. I agree with contacting people, I don't agree with the stir that is being caused by all of the false information being put out there by people who are either incapable or unwilling to read the information available.

 

[O4L]

I agree that there are a lot of fear mongers, especially on YouTube, that are stirring people up.

They like stirring people up because it makes their subscription counts go up, and guess what...they make more money.

We will see if any of this goes anywhere especially after the election but for now there is mostly just a lot if speculation.