can you suggest something that can actually happen?
Ok, I'll listen. Post up some numbers and back up how you think it would work.
One of the excuses I read somewhere was that the Oklahoma Education Association had for many years bargained for increases to benefits rather than salary on the theory that it was easier to come back later and convince voters that salaries were too low rather than benefits needed to be increased. I have no idea whether there's any truth to that or not, and suspect actual benefit levels vary widely throughout the state.
There are problems with this that most people outside education don't understand and that's OK because you're not in it so you wouldn't know. However, with private school, students can be accepted for enrollment or rejected. They can choose who enrolls in their schools and who they reject. Also, parents with special needs students would not find much help in private school education because they do not usually have special education programs and don't want them either. A lot of people also don't understand that parents of special education students in public schools can be given a voucher towards private schools if they are unsatisfied with public school. It's called the HB 1744 or Lindsey Nicole Henry Act. Problem with that bill, as seen by some parents I know who have actually used the voucher is that it only covers a very small portion of private school tuition. Like it or not, public schools provide something no private school ever will; they can't discriminate based on race, socioeconomic background, education level, parent involvement, ability to pay for anything, adverse behavior and any mental or physical disability.
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We could to the same thing with law enforcement, potable water delivery and fire fighting.
And, many of our other socialized services:
socialized military
socialized emergency services
socialized highway transportation
socialized public park system
socialized disability services
socialized healthcare (in the context of social security/medicare)
socialized farming protections (e.g., subsidies)
socialized corporate protections (i.e., corporate welfare)
Not to derail this discussion, but I do have one question to throw out to the wolves: Is anyone familiar with a school system either near or far (out of state obviously) that is well-recognized for doing an excellent job educating students, adequately providing for teachers, etc.? I'd be curious to hear about what has been proven to work and why.
I believe so if public sector. I know someone who works for the state in a different capacity and they receive a statement of pay that shows their total compensation in dollar amount that includes the paid benefits and retirement...That is a good point...You could have someone working for more money than a teacher but the net compensation could be the same or less if you figure in total compensation...I know my aunt & uncle enjoy those two checks they receive every month for the rest of their lives despite retiring in their 50's...he works various other jobs to supplement that income too while he still can. Pretty good deal BUT I still think that a Master's degree teacher with 20yrs on the job should make more than 42k as someone reported earlier in the thread...I see both sides.
they were under the old retirement plan, now they would have to work to the age of 62.5.
Here are some observations from a 30 year educator in Oklahoma, take it for what is worth.
Keep in mind, I knew full well what I was getting into and was cognizant of the limitations that came with the career. Nearly every teacher will tell you that the important things about their jobs are the intrinsic ones. The ability to affect lives and impact future generations is a powerful motivator for the educators that do it for the right reasons. An individual who teaches for anything else, monetary reasons or otherwise, will be one of those who hates their jobs, hates kids, and hates everyone around them. I've seen my fair share of those through the years.
Economics: In 1987 when I started my first year, $16,060 was my beginning salary. Adjusted for inflation rates, that is equivalent to $34,569.15 in 2017 dollars. Current salary puts me at approximately $6,000.00 above the adjusted number so I have managed around $200/year incremental increase over my starting salary in the past 30 years. It didn't move the needle on the money improvement gauge, but like I said before, I knew what I was signing up for. I don't ***** or complain. I, like many others, work extra jobs to fill in the gaps.
State of Education: Do you think that there was a great debate about the quality and funding of education 80 years ago? Nope! I'll tell you why, and it's a matter of local vs. central control. It used to be that WE, parents and teachers of a given community were responsible for educating our own kids. WE determined what was relevant and important to our kids. WE were invested in seeing success. WE valued what was successful because it was personal to us on a local level. We had our own standards.
It isn't that way now. Education is top-down and upside-down. The state takes precedent over the local, and the government takes precedent over the state. Tons of money is wasted from a far away downhill slide of bureaucratic crap made up by people who could care less about a kid that lives 2 houses down from you and I. It creates an atmosphere where no one wants to be accountable and everything is done to artificial "standards". Too many educators these days are just chasing test scores, to validate some politicians notion of success. Throwing more money into the way it is now, and you can bet your ass it's going into the money eating machine without ever seeing the other side, not into teaching.
Here is my own personal philosophy on teaching, and it doesn't come from the government, it doesn't come from the state, and it doesn't require loads of money. It comes from ME, a vested member in my community. The same community that educated me when I was a young one and the one I'm responsible to now.
Teaching is a simple thing, it's pure in its nature form. Turning a kid on to learn whatever interests them, doesn't matter what, is the key. Getting them to see value in learning new things, taking an interest in their own future, infecting them with the joy of possibilities. It's my hope that each one of them finds their own path and desires to make something of themselves.
Unfortunately, the government (state and federal) has in usual fashion complicated the entire process. As we all know, nothing controlled by government is ever done efficiently, productively, or economically.
Keep in mind, I knew full well what I was getting into and was cognizant of the limitations that came with the career. Nearly every teacher will tell you that the important things about their jobs are the intrinsic ones. The ability to affect lives and impact future generations is a powerful motivator for the educators that do it for the right reasons. An individual who teaches for anything else, monetary reasons or otherwise, will be one of those who hates their jobs, hates kids, and hates everyone around them. I've seen my fair share of those through the years.
Economics: In 1987 when I started my first year, $16,060 was my beginning salary. Adjusted for inflation rates, that is equivalent to $34,569.15 in 2017 dollars. Current salary puts me at approximately $6,000.00 above the adjusted number so I have managed around $200/year incremental increase over my starting salary in the past 30 years. It didn't move the needle on the money improvement gauge, but like I said before, I knew what I was signing up for. I don't ***** or complain. I, like many others, work extra jobs to fill in the gaps.
State of Education: Do you think that there was a great debate about the quality and funding of education 80 years ago? Nope! I'll tell you why, and it's a matter of local vs. central control. It used to be that WE, parents and teachers of a given community were responsible for educating our own kids. WE determined what was relevant and important to our kids. WE were invested in seeing success. WE valued what was successful because it was personal to us on a local level. We had our own standards.
It isn't that way now. Education is top-down and upside-down. The state takes precedent over the local, and the government takes precedent over the state. Tons of money is wasted from a far away downhill slide of bureaucratic crap made up by people who could care less about a kid that lives 2 houses down from you and I. It creates an atmosphere where no one wants to be accountable and everything is done to artificial "standards". Too many educators these days are just chasing test scores, to validate some politicians notion of success. Throwing more money into the way it is now, and you can bet your ass it's going into the money eating machine without ever seeing the other side, not into teaching.
Here is my own personal philosophy on teaching, and it doesn't come from the government, it doesn't come from the state, and it doesn't require loads of money. It comes from ME, a vested member in my community. The same community that educated me when I was a young one and the one I'm responsible to now.
Teaching is a simple thing, it's pure in its nature form. Turning a kid on to learn whatever interests them, doesn't matter what, is the key. Getting them to see value in learning new things, taking an interest in their own future, infecting them with the joy of possibilities. It's my hope that each one of them finds their own path and desires to make something of themselves.
Unfortunately, the government (state and federal) has in usual fashion complicated the entire process. As we all know, nothing controlled by government is ever done efficiently, productively, or economically.
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