Keith Rainbow 405-761-8312
No I don't. Maybe try Gunsmith.
Shoot with the knowledge of guns from that era.
I had a Damascus sxs years ago before it was stolen that I shot all the time with shotshells loaded with black powder. Killed many dove and rabbits with that gun.
They are only dangerous if shot with modern shotshells.
The problem with damascus barrels is they were pieces of wire wrapped around a mandrel and forge welded.
Over the last 100+ years moisture has gotten into the seams of the welds and weakened them. When you start shooting the gun the barrels can unwind like a slinky toy. This doesn't matter what powder you use.
Smokeless is a propellant
Black powder is an explosive
When they get ready to blow either will do it.
Over the last 100+ years moisture has gotten into the seams of the welds and weakened them. When you start shooting the gun the barrels can unwind like a slinky toy. This doesn't matter what powder you use.
Smokeless is a propellant
Black powder is an explosive
When they get ready to blow either will do it.
Is he still doing work? I've tried contacting him several times over the years with no luck.
Yes, he is. He is sometimes difficult to get ahold of. Last I knew, he had moved his shop back to his home.
On European doubles you will find the proofs on the bottom of each barrel near the breach end.
They can tell you a lot about when and where a gun was made. The marks were unique for the proofing houses and changed as wars reshaped the political landscape. Gun making was more of a cottage industry and the name on the gun is often the retailer. This is very common for low end doubles from Begum made prior to WWI.
The good thing about European proofs is you can tell if the gun was proofed for black powder only or black and nitro (smokeless). I have SXS's that only have black powder proofs, but have steel barrels and tight actions. A bit of knowledge is needed for those black to smokeless transition era guns.
In the US the marks are a bit different and applied by the manufacturer.
We don't have a government proof house that tests guns and ammo before they are retailed.
The markings will be manufacturer specific and the amount of information available will vary depending on the manufacture.
If the gun is pre WWI, a knowledgeable gunsmith will check the chamber dimensions with a proper gage.
Some chambers of that era are short and have odd dimensions.
The issue is a modern crimped shotgun shell has pleats that fold forward when it goes off. The open length is longer than the old all brass and paper/card over shot type shells. So a modern shell drops in and cycles fine, but when it opens its too long and the pleats are longer than the chamber. They enter the barrel and cant open all the way, restricting the flow of shot from the shell. The shot compresses down in the wad and hopefully makes its way past without bulging or rupturing the barrel, but the pressures go way up.
Basic tests for a SXS pre purchase.
Look at the locking lever, it should be on center to right of center when locked (assuming top lever, right push to open). Left of center and the locking system is well worn.
Pop the fore arm off
Flip it over and release the action lever.
Shake it.
If the gun has significant ware, you can feel it. It should be tight without the forearm in place and without the locking system holding it shut.
Take the barrels off and confirm that the hinge point on the barrel has not been shimmed. Sometimes this is done well with real shim stock and the face is refitted- that's a downgrade, but acceptable if done professionally. Business cards and playing card shims are a different story, that's someone trying to dump their trash on you.
Check the proofs (if applicable)
Verify serial numbers match.
Check external hammers for push off with thumb pressure.
Check the chamber depth (especially on European guns)
They can tell you a lot about when and where a gun was made. The marks were unique for the proofing houses and changed as wars reshaped the political landscape. Gun making was more of a cottage industry and the name on the gun is often the retailer. This is very common for low end doubles from Begum made prior to WWI.
The good thing about European proofs is you can tell if the gun was proofed for black powder only or black and nitro (smokeless). I have SXS's that only have black powder proofs, but have steel barrels and tight actions. A bit of knowledge is needed for those black to smokeless transition era guns.
In the US the marks are a bit different and applied by the manufacturer.
We don't have a government proof house that tests guns and ammo before they are retailed.
The markings will be manufacturer specific and the amount of information available will vary depending on the manufacture.
If the gun is pre WWI, a knowledgeable gunsmith will check the chamber dimensions with a proper gage.
Some chambers of that era are short and have odd dimensions.
The issue is a modern crimped shotgun shell has pleats that fold forward when it goes off. The open length is longer than the old all brass and paper/card over shot type shells. So a modern shell drops in and cycles fine, but when it opens its too long and the pleats are longer than the chamber. They enter the barrel and cant open all the way, restricting the flow of shot from the shell. The shot compresses down in the wad and hopefully makes its way past without bulging or rupturing the barrel, but the pressures go way up.
Basic tests for a SXS pre purchase.
Look at the locking lever, it should be on center to right of center when locked (assuming top lever, right push to open). Left of center and the locking system is well worn.
Pop the fore arm off
Flip it over and release the action lever.
Shake it.
If the gun has significant ware, you can feel it. It should be tight without the forearm in place and without the locking system holding it shut.
Take the barrels off and confirm that the hinge point on the barrel has not been shimmed. Sometimes this is done well with real shim stock and the face is refitted- that's a downgrade, but acceptable if done professionally. Business cards and playing card shims are a different story, that's someone trying to dump their trash on you.
Check the proofs (if applicable)
Verify serial numbers match.
Check external hammers for push off with thumb pressure.
Check the chamber depth (especially on European guns)
I took it up to @SPDguns to check it out. He said that the barrels are still soldered together correctly, that there's some pitting in the bores, but that it's ok and shows that the barrels haven't been honed which would make the walls thinner. The replacement stock was fitted well. There are gaps of a couple thousandths where the breaches and receiver meet and one of the firing pins is missing (I ordered a replacement from eBay). I may take it to Champlin Arms for a full inspection.
Great information. Very good description. One can't go wrong
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