Shooting "not to kill"

[chuter]

I figure I can have compassion for the perp, what a sh*t life he/she has had that has led them to a moment where they think it's a good idea to hurt me or my loved ones.
But in that moment it's irrelevant.
You can't blame a rattlesnake for being a rattlesnake, but if he's about to hurt me or mine I'm going to do my best to see that I'm the one walking away.

 

[gerhard1]

Shoot to stop, not to kill. For legal reasons and your own peace of mind.
Not talking about where to aim, but your intent.
Unfortunately for the perp, the best way to stop someone also happens to be the way most likely to kill them.

Agreed; this is my attitude as well. You don't shoot to kill, you don't shoot to wound. You shoot to stop whatever action forced you to shoot in the first place.

You are also correct in that the most likely means of stoiopping someone without them hurting you, is a CNS shot that completely short-circuits their nervous system. Unfortunately, these shots are also usually fatal.

 

[dennishoddy]

FWIW, I'd highly recommend a .22mag over a .22LR.

Just sayin'...

In a rifle, yes. I did a field test with a .22 mag in a 2 1/2" barrel pistol. Barely got 1100 fps on the chrony.
.22lr CCI Stingers were faster.
.22 mag powders are made for rifles.
The recoil impulse on .22 mag is problematic in semi auto pistols and semi auto rifles. There are exceptions.


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[MacFromOK]

In a rifle, yes. I did a field test with a .22 mag in a 2 1/2" barrel pistol. Barely got 1100 fps on the chrony.
.22lr CCI Stingers were faster.
.22 mag powders are made for rifles.
The recoil impulse on .22 mag is problematic in semi auto pistols and semi auto rifles. There are exceptions.

"Mini Manstoppers: Using A .22 WMR Load For Self-Defense"
http://www.personaldefenseworld.com/2015/07/mini-manstoppers-using-a-22-wmr-load-for-self-defense/

 

[tomthebaker]

I practice head shots, so ...

 

[dennishoddy]

"Mini Manstoppers: Using A .22 WMR Load For Self-Defense"
http://www.personaldefenseworld.com/2015/07/mini-manstoppers-using-a-22-wmr-load-for-self-defense/

I use both Gold Dots and Critical Defense.

That article backs up my comments.
What they have done is generate a new bullet that performs at lower velocities.
The gold dots designed for Pistol velocities, aren't any faster in a short barrel, merely softer lead for easier expansion.
Kind of misleading because they call it a man stopper.
It's not the preferred caliber, but it will do the job. There have been one shot kills with a .22, but they are rare.

 

[operator742]

I know a .22 will kill someone with perfect shot placement, but I can't get on board with it for self defense. You never point a gun at something you don't want to destroy, and if I fear for my safety or my family's safety I fully intend to destroy the threat. And more the likely that means kill ,not out of want ,but out of necessity.

 

[MacFromOK]

That article backs up my comments.
What they have done is generate a new bullet that performs at lower velocities.
The gold dots designed for Pistol velocities, aren't any faster in a short barrel, merely softer lead for easier expansion.

Well... not exactly.

They clocked from 1000 fps with a 1.12" barrel (less than half the length of your 2.5" barrel), to 1200 fps with a 2" barrel (still 20% shorter than your 2.5" barrel).

You are correct in that the bullets are also improved, having better penetration and expansion:

"Hornady’s .22 WMR Critical Defense load penetrates just under 10 inches in 10 percent ballistic gelatin. The Speer load penetrates an average of 12 inches in water, which roughly corresponds to the penetration of the Critical Defense load in gelatin. Winchester states that the PDX1 penetrates nearly 12 inches in gelatin.
...
Bullet expansion and energy transfer combine to form the third criterion. The Hornady, Speer and Winchester loads expand well, and they all transfer more than the minimum 58 fpe determined by the Army’s Surgeon General to be “disabling energy.”

And while it will never compete head to head with larger calibers...

"Even so, the new .22 WMR defense loads transfer enough energy to the body to create pressure waves that can significantly tear large blood vessels and cause serious fracturing in organs like the brain, liver and kidneys."

When fired into a test medium like water or ballistic gelatin...

- Hornady’s 45-grain Critical Defense load (with the FTX bullet) "ensures reliable expansion to .30 caliber." It leaves a 1.12-inch barrel at about 1,000 fps and produces approximately 100 foot-pounds of energy (fpe).
- Speer 40-grain Gold Dot "fragments and expands to about .31 caliber." It leaves a 1.12-inch barrel at 1,050 fps and generates 99 fpe.
- Winchester’s PDX1 40-grain "expands reliably to around .30 caliber." It leaves a 2-inch barrel at 1,200 fps, generating about 140 fpe.

Again, shot placement is key. I wholeheartedly agree it's not the best choice, and probably even less so for a novice.

 

[SPDguns]

Shoot to stop the threat. Side effect=death........

 

[surjimmy]

Until she is willing to use deadly force to defend her life, she has no need for a gun. It will be taken away from her and used on her and maybe some innocent. She can always quit walking, or go to a mall.