So is this justified or not?

[PJM]

So do these two situations share a commonality? Because I see two different scenarios here. The OK one involved a person known to have mental issues including suicidal and homicidal threats. A history of making threats and apparently carrying devices with which to carry those out, to the point that she was expelled from school So back to the question in the OK incident what would you have done?

 

[PJM]

Well, this is a very sticky situation. Let's HYPOTHESIZE that a HYPOTHETICAL person like one of us, someone relatively opinionated on political and 2A matters, .GOV overreach, society's progression towards socialism, etc., is having a convo with one of their child's teachers, or their doctor, or really ANYONE they know casually, but not particularly well, and makes the assumption this person is both aligned with their conservative views and also trustworthy - both of which are EXTREMELY dangerous assumptions.

So, in the course of this casual conversation, they're both commiserating on the general state of things, and our HYPOTHETICAL person says, "Damn, man, I can see where someone would want to go shoot up the courthouse, based on some of the shite these politicians are doing."

Now... our other party maybe is a bit more 'moderate' or a bit more... shall we say, nervous? As in, they don't oppose firearms, per se, but they aren't exposed to them regularly, are a little uncomfortable with 'some of those people' having them, etc. And they decide this person needs to be disarmed, or at least investigated. So this is a person who is ostensibly in a position of some authority AND a position of some responsibility. AND their recall of the conversation may not be particularly accurate, and all of a sudden, the report becomes, "This guy was ranting about the government and said he understood why someone would kill all the politicians at the capitol and he has a TON of guns in his house, I know!"

So... how do you think this plays out when a doctor, a teacher, a school administrator or anyone else generally considered a "responsible professional" makes this report to law enforcement? How long do you think before this guy gets visited at work by people with badges, perhaps escorted out in cuffs from his insurance adjuster job, his house has a SWAT van pull up outside and his door kicked in and then neighbors see officers carrying out dozens of long guns, handguns, cases of ammo and file cabinets full of paperwork (looking for 'manifestos', of course).

How many of us would unintentionally, and completely INNOCENTLY, fall into this trap??? Over some silly, offhanded and harmless comment or exaggeration? Seriously?

And how many of us would have an 'arsenal' carted out of our house, reported on by media and filmed by reporters across the street or by a chopper overhead? And how many of us would subsequently be shunned by neighbors, fellow church members, maybe even lose our jobs, or at LEAST lose clientele, due to news and newspaper coverage, Facebook slanderizing, and word of mouth that is almost NEVER accurate to the real situation?

How quickly could your life and livelihood be ruined? Kinda scary, huh?

Reminds me of that old adage "Keep your words soft and sweet because you never know which ones you'll eat."

 

[BobbyV]

Well, this is a very sticky situation. Let's HYPOTHESIZE that a HYPOTHETICAL person like one of us, someone relatively opinionated on political and 2A matters, .GOV overreach, society's progression towards socialism, etc., is having a convo with one of their child's teachers, or their doctor, or really ANYONE they know casually, but not particularly well, and makes the assumption this person is both aligned with their conservative views and also trustworthy - both of which are EXTREMELY dangerous assumptions.

So, in the course of this casual conversation, they're both commiserating on the general state of things, and our HYPOTHETICAL person says, "Damn, man, I can see where someone would want to go shoot up the courthouse, based on some of the shite these politicians are doing."

Now... our other party maybe is a bit more 'moderate' or a bit more... shall we say, nervous? As in, they don't oppose firearms, per se, but they aren't exposed to them regularly, are a little uncomfortable with 'some of those people' having them, etc. And they decide this person needs to be disarmed, or at least investigated. So this is a person who is ostensibly in a position of some authority AND a position of some responsibility. AND their recall of the conversation may not be particularly accurate, and all of a sudden, the report becomes, "This guy was ranting about the government and said he understood why someone would kill all the politicians at the capitol and he has a TON of guns in his house, I know!"

So... how do you think this plays out when a doctor, a teacher, a school administrator or anyone else generally considered a "responsible professional" makes this report to law enforcement? How long do you think before this guy gets visited at work by people with badges, perhaps escorted out in cuffs from his insurance adjuster job, his house has a SWAT van pull up outside and his door kicked in and then neighbors see officers carrying out dozens of long guns, handguns, cases of ammo and file cabinets full of paperwork (looking for 'manifestos', of course).

How many of us would unintentionally, and completely INNOCENTLY, fall into this trap??? Over some silly, offhanded and harmless comment or exaggeration? Seriously?

And how many of us would have an 'arsenal' carted out of our house, reported on by media and filmed by reporters across the street or by a chopper overhead? And how many of us would subsequently be shunned by neighbors, fellow church members, maybe even lose our jobs, or at LEAST lose clientele, due to news and newspaper coverage, Facebook slanderizing, and word of mouth that is almost NEVER accurate to the real situation?

How quickly could your life and livelihood be ruined? Kinda scary, huh?

I've definitely been known to say stupid things without thinking, but the situation you describe here is something I can't personally relate to.

In this day and age we can't be too careful about how and where we express our opinion on a specific situation or topic.

I'm sure there are others who might make a comment similar to the one you provided at the beginning of your post. Just as I'm sure there are folks who might twist it into something it isn't.

I've worked for Uncle Sam too long I guess and have some how been able to stop myself before saying something stupid. At least most of the time anyway. Especially something remotely close to what you posted.


For this particular 18 year-old though . . . do you not think she should've been snatched up and looked into further?

 

[CHenry]

Who sold an 18 yo a rifle?
Isnt it 21? Or is that just for handguns?

 

[p238shooter]

The key here is the threat. That in and of itself is a crime. They need to push for prosecution and the DA needs to consider the totality of the circumstances before declining any case against her. IMO, this is proof you don't need a Red Flag law to prevent potential mass killings. You need follow through on the laws already in place.

It seems we need to get back to all threats should be take seriously. When I was growing up when someone threatened me, they were usually the first person to have a bent nose. Threatening someone was taken as a searious real item that they were going to do something at their first opportunity. I tried to avoid giving them that first opportunity.

But I guess this has gone the same way as telling a lie, it seems that is an expected common practice now days instead of someone getting blackballed, fired, or the stuff beat out of them. Today it seems there are no repercussions for being an open dishonest individual. Sad Times.

 

[Fyrtwuck]

The biggest positives of the whole situation is that she did not harm anyone and she’s alive to be assessed and evaluated.

 

[Aries]

Who sold an 18 yo a rifle?
Isnt it 21? Or is that just for handguns?

18 for rifles, 21 for handguns.

Edit: Rifles and shotguns (or long guns)

 

[druryj]

The biggest positives of the whole situation is that she did not harm anyone and she’s alive to be assessed and evaluated.

Well said. And yes, the actions of the Police were totally justified. Better to avert a tragedy than to respond to one.

 

[tRidiot]

For this particular 18 year-old though . . . do you not think she should've been snatched up and looked into further?

I'm not saying she should not have been. I don't really know. Yes... the way that story reads, it certainly sounds justified. But then, the media, law enforcement and the reporting party(or parties) are usually always going to exaggerate in favor of maximizing the 'threat'. Just like Beto Effing O'Rourke reporting another member of Congress to the FBI over his response to Beto's threat to take away his AR15 - "My AR15 is ready for you." And Billy-Badass-Beto F-tard O'Rourke wants that to be taken seriously as a threat to his safety.

Welcome to the Pussification of America.

My thoughts are, AS REPORTED, that story sounds reasonably justified - I just don't trust f-tard reporters these days than I trust f-tard politicians to tell the truth or be accurate in their descriptions of... well, anything, really.

 

[BobbyV]

I'm not saying she should not have been. I don't really know. Yes... the way that story reads, it certainly sounds justified. But then, the media, law enforcement and the reporting party(or parties) are usually always going to exaggerate in favor of maximizing the 'threat'. Just like Beto Effing O'Rourke reporting another member of Congress to the FBI over his response to Beto's threat to take away his AR15 - "My AR15 is ready for you." And Billy-Badass-Beto F-tard O'Rourke wants that to be taken seriously as a threat to his safety.

Welcome to the Pussification of America.

My thoughts are, AS REPORTED, that story sounds reasonably justified - I just don't trust f-tard reporters these days than I trust f-tard politicians to tell the truth or be accurate in their descriptions of... well, anything, really.

Fair enough . . . that dude who posted that in response to Beto could've done so slightly different so there wasn't any confusion IMO.

But I agree, Beto way overreacted about the comment. He definitely seems completely out of touch with life himself.