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What do you guys think about neck shots.
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<blockquote data-quote="Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow" data-source="post: 1356137" data-attributes="member: 7123"><p>I think they're the "only way to fly" with a rifle or ML (not archery) - *particularly* when (a) it's the last day/hour of the hunt, and you have somewhere to be soon and don't have time to wait and track, and/or (b) when you're hunting near an adjacent owner's land and have no idea whether you can easily get permission to go on their land to track - or if you KNOW the landowner is an A-hole, etc. </p><p></p><p>Only time to NOT run with a neck shot is if the body is exposed but the neck hidden by brush etc, OR if the animal is so far away that the body shot is the only viable target with a reasonable (ethical) chance of hitting, based on likely field hold error, etc. Body shots are the exception to the rule of CNS shots (head/neck), AFAIAC.</p><p></p><p>Aim for the white spot. At the top/thin part of the neck, by the head. With an ML or slow centerfire (.45-70, .44 mag, etc.) use an ALL (soft) LEAD, HP bullet - or round ball - for maximum expansion. With a bottle-necked (high-vel) centerfire, pretty much anything will work, but avoid the extremes at both ends - avoid super light/ lightly-constructed or heavy/ heavily-constructed bullets, and run with a middle of the road soft point or ballistic tip (so that if you need to, you CAN take an ethical body shot, even a quartering one). Something like an 80 or 85 for example in .243/6mm, a 90-100 in a .25 cal, a 115-120 in a 6.5, 130 in a .270, a 130-140 in a 7mm, or a 140-150 in .30 cal. </p><p></p><p>If I find myself "stuck" hunting with a jacketed bullet (rather than all lead) during ML season as I did this year, then I'm going to favor a heart/lung shot over a neck shot, but either will work. Ditto if I have a heavy-for caliber, heavily-constructed bullet in a bottlenecked centerfire.</p><p></p><p>Sometimes a quick second shot is required to put them down, but no problem - they're *right there* to put that 2nd shot in. I suppose if you're averse to any kind of suffering, then you might say that using an ML in this manner is not ethical, because if you hit the trachea, etc., not spine, and a second shot is required, it may take you a minute or more to reload and deliver the coup de grace - I really can't argue with that.</p><p></p><p>After hearing my buddy's stories of lost elk (two in one year - after hours of searching by multiple people) hit hard with a ML (.50 cal powerbelt jacketed HP), I can't help but think that a round soft lead ball in .50, .54, .58, or larger, is about the only sensible way to go after elk with an ML - neck shot of course. Not because the powerbelt to the lungs didn't kill them graveyard dead ethically, but because it killed them dead ethically 50-500 yards away from where they were standing, with no blood trail.</p><p></p><p>I view head shots as ethical ONLY when the deer is very close-in, pristine dead-on-hold conditions, since the risk is so high of missing and injuring the animal (blow off the jaw) if it moves its head just as you shoot, and dooming it to a slow painful death. So in a nutshell: at 15 yards or less, base of ear. 15-90/100 or so, neck (this will encompass the vast majority of shots). Past that, use the larger target of heart/lungs.</p><p></p><p>If you view tracking as fun and exciting, and feel it is your duty to occasionally help provide the buzzards and song dogs with welfare, then don't take CNS shots. But if you view tracking (as I do) as an anxiety-inducing pre-cursor to possible animal loss, then neck shots or head shots all the way. DRT is the best way to hunt! <img src="/images/smilies/biggrin.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":D" title="Big Grin :D" data-shortname=":D" /> YMMV and all that - I'm far from being an expert on hunting.</p><p></p><p>Archery, whole nuther story....heart & lungs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Jiminy-Criminy! Grandma is tougher'n nails! How'd you ever find her? <img src="/images/smilies/eek.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":eek:" title="EEK! :eek:" data-shortname=":eek:" /></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Umm, well, dead-on level, yeah - but from any angle, up or down, such as from a tree stand, then no, that's a surefire recipe for gutshot and lost suffering then dead deer - just clarifying- you're much better off just "envisioning the soccer ball" in the heart/lung area from wherever you are, and aiming for the center of that soccer ball - if you're up above, then you'd aim for the spine from just behind the "soccer ball", angling down into the middle of it, not the poop hole, if the deer is moving directly away. Or for the rear of the neck/spine, above the back. As for running deer in any direction, no I don't think so - not ethical at all, IMO - unless it's moving broadside and you're dead-eye-Dick. For ME, not ethical in the slightest - but I don't practice on moving targets myself.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow, post: 1356137, member: 7123"] I think they're the "only way to fly" with a rifle or ML (not archery) - *particularly* when (a) it's the last day/hour of the hunt, and you have somewhere to be soon and don't have time to wait and track, and/or (b) when you're hunting near an adjacent owner's land and have no idea whether you can easily get permission to go on their land to track - or if you KNOW the landowner is an A-hole, etc. Only time to NOT run with a neck shot is if the body is exposed but the neck hidden by brush etc, OR if the animal is so far away that the body shot is the only viable target with a reasonable (ethical) chance of hitting, based on likely field hold error, etc. Body shots are the exception to the rule of CNS shots (head/neck), AFAIAC. Aim for the white spot. At the top/thin part of the neck, by the head. With an ML or slow centerfire (.45-70, .44 mag, etc.) use an ALL (soft) LEAD, HP bullet - or round ball - for maximum expansion. With a bottle-necked (high-vel) centerfire, pretty much anything will work, but avoid the extremes at both ends - avoid super light/ lightly-constructed or heavy/ heavily-constructed bullets, and run with a middle of the road soft point or ballistic tip (so that if you need to, you CAN take an ethical body shot, even a quartering one). Something like an 80 or 85 for example in .243/6mm, a 90-100 in a .25 cal, a 115-120 in a 6.5, 130 in a .270, a 130-140 in a 7mm, or a 140-150 in .30 cal. If I find myself "stuck" hunting with a jacketed bullet (rather than all lead) during ML season as I did this year, then I'm going to favor a heart/lung shot over a neck shot, but either will work. Ditto if I have a heavy-for caliber, heavily-constructed bullet in a bottlenecked centerfire. Sometimes a quick second shot is required to put them down, but no problem - they're *right there* to put that 2nd shot in. I suppose if you're averse to any kind of suffering, then you might say that using an ML in this manner is not ethical, because if you hit the trachea, etc., not spine, and a second shot is required, it may take you a minute or more to reload and deliver the coup de grace - I really can't argue with that. After hearing my buddy's stories of lost elk (two in one year - after hours of searching by multiple people) hit hard with a ML (.50 cal powerbelt jacketed HP), I can't help but think that a round soft lead ball in .50, .54, .58, or larger, is about the only sensible way to go after elk with an ML - neck shot of course. Not because the powerbelt to the lungs didn't kill them graveyard dead ethically, but because it killed them dead ethically 50-500 yards away from where they were standing, with no blood trail. I view head shots as ethical ONLY when the deer is very close-in, pristine dead-on-hold conditions, since the risk is so high of missing and injuring the animal (blow off the jaw) if it moves its head just as you shoot, and dooming it to a slow painful death. So in a nutshell: at 15 yards or less, base of ear. 15-90/100 or so, neck (this will encompass the vast majority of shots). Past that, use the larger target of heart/lungs. If you view tracking as fun and exciting, and feel it is your duty to occasionally help provide the buzzards and song dogs with welfare, then don't take CNS shots. But if you view tracking (as I do) as an anxiety-inducing pre-cursor to possible animal loss, then neck shots or head shots all the way. DRT is the best way to hunt! :D YMMV and all that - I'm far from being an expert on hunting. Archery, whole nuther story....heart & lungs. Jiminy-Criminy! Grandma is tougher'n nails! How'd you ever find her? :eek: Umm, well, dead-on level, yeah - but from any angle, up or down, such as from a tree stand, then no, that's a surefire recipe for gutshot and lost suffering then dead deer - just clarifying- you're much better off just "envisioning the soccer ball" in the heart/lung area from wherever you are, and aiming for the center of that soccer ball - if you're up above, then you'd aim for the spine from just behind the "soccer ball", angling down into the middle of it, not the poop hole, if the deer is moving directly away. Or for the rear of the neck/spine, above the back. As for running deer in any direction, no I don't think so - not ethical at all, IMO - unless it's moving broadside and you're dead-eye-Dick. For ME, not ethical in the slightest - but I don't practice on moving targets myself. [/QUOTE]
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