What is a Pre-May Dealer Sample?

[ez bake]

I searched the site and didn't find anything, so I thought I'd ask here - I understand the basics of the various laws listed here:

http://www.paladinarmory.com/LegalTips.htm#Pre-May Dealer Sample:

But the term: Pre-May Dealer Sample has always eluded me - is this a gun manufactured prior to the May 19, 1986 date that was dubbed non-transferable even though it was made on/before that magic date?

If so, what was done to make such a firearm non-transferable?

Didn't want to crap on Patrick's post in the classifieds, but I've always wondered what that term meant and his post reminded me of that fact.

 

[Glocktogo]

A pre-May dealer sample is a full auto that was manufactured for civilian sale prior to May 19, 1986 but was not subsequently transferred to a civilian buyer prior to the cutoff. These are worth a little more than post samples because a dealer can purchase one from another dealer and then transfer it to their private collection if they give up their license. However, they may not subsequently transfer it to another person. When they die it must be destroyed per ATF regulations, or turned over to ATF.

Pre-May dealer samples are not transferrable in other words.

 

[CAR-AR-M16]

A pre-May dealer sample is a full auto that was manufactured for civilian sale prior to May 19, 1986 but was not subsequently transferred to a civilian buyer prior to the cutoff. These are worth a little more than post samples because a dealer can purchase one from another dealer and then transfer it to their private collection if they give up their license. However, they may not subsequently transfer it to another person. When they die it must be destroyed per ATF regulations, or turned over to ATF.

Pre-May dealer samples are not transferrable in other words.

Glocktogo has almost got it all, but left out a few things. Prior to 1968 a citizen could transfer into their possession any MG that was made domestically or of foreign manufacture. The passage of the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA 68) prohibited the importation of foreign made MG’s for transfer to civilians, however they could be imported for military/LEO applications and bought by FFL holders with an SOT (Special Occupational Taxholder) as “Dealer Samples”. No demo letter is required. The dealer sample could be retained by the owner if he gave up his FFL/SOT, but it could only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT dealer, never to an individual.

The Firearm Owners Protection Act (FOPA) went into effect in May of 1986 and prohibited the manufacture of domestic MG’s for civilians, but they can still be made for military/LEO applications and bought by FFL/SOT holders as “Post 86 Dealer Samples”. Post 86 Samples require a demo letter from an agency in order for a dealer to acquire one. The Post 86 dealer sample cannot be retained by the owner if he gives up his FFL. It must transfer to another FFL/SOT dealer before going out of business.

So, in brief:

Transferable is a pre 68 foreign made MG or pre 86 domestically made MG. Can be owned by an individual.

Pre May 86 Dealer Sample is a foreign made MG imported between 1968 and 1986 (or a US made MG that was exported and then re-imported in this period). Can be owned by an FFL/SOT and retained upon giving up license. Demo letter is not required. Can only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT.

Post May 86 Dealer Sample is any MG made after 1986. Can be owned by an FFL/SOT, but requires a demo letter from an agency and cannot be retained upon giving up license. Can only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT.

 

[stewball]

Does anyone know the actual numbers of transferable, both pre 68 imports and pre 86 weapons there are in the registry? I've heard around 117,000. Is it possible to see a breakdown on the types and numbers of these?

Just curious.

Stew

 

[Glocktogo]

Glocktogo has almost got it all, but left out a few things. Prior to 1968 a citizen could transfer into their possession any MG that was made domestically or of foreign manufacture. The passage of the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA 68) prohibited the importation of foreign made MG’s for transfer to civilians, however they could be imported for military/LEO applications and bought by FFL holders with an SOT (Special Occupational Taxholder) as “Dealer Samples”. No demo letter is required. The dealer sample could be retained by the owner if he gave up his FFL/SOT, but it could only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT dealer, never to an individual.

The Firearm Owners Protection Act (FOPA) went into effect in May of 1986 and prohibited the manufacture of domestic MG’s for civilians, but they can still be made for military/LEO applications and bought by FFL/SOT holders as “Post 86 Dealer Samples”. Post 86 Samples require a demo letter from an agency in order for a dealer to acquire one. The Post 86 dealer sample cannot be retained by the owner if he gives up his FFL. It must transfer to another FFL/SOT dealer before going out of business.

So, in brief:

Transferable is a pre 68 foreign made MG or pre 86 domestically made MG. Can be owned by an individual.

Pre May 86 Dealer Sample is a foreign made MG imported between 1968 and 1986 (or a US made MG that was exported and then re-imported in this period). Can be owned by an FFL/SOT and retained upon giving up license. Demo letter is not required. Can only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT.

Post May 86 Dealer Sample is any MG made after 1986. Can be owned by an FFL/SOT, but requires a demo letter from an agency and cannot be retained upon giving up license. Can only ever transfer to another FFL/SOT.

Yeah, what he said!

 

[Seedy]

EZ...thanks for asking this question. I've wondered this myself.

So, in the case of a post 86 full auto (say a Glock 18), that is in the possession of a FFL/SOT, what happens if they want to keep the gun "for life"? Would it be possible for them to keep their liscense indefinitely? I assume there is an annual cost to maintain your FFL/SOT liscense...and probably some other requirements. Would anyone mind expounding or linking to some info?

...also, what is a "demo letter"?

...I've drooled over the full auto Glocks for a while now. I realize that without becoming a dealer (not something I plan on doing) I will most likely never be able to own one...however I sure do hope someone brings one to the NFA shoot at USSA (*nudge*hint*nudge*)

 

[blackknight22]

In theory a FFL/SOT could keep the Glock 18 for life as long as he maintained his FFL/SOT.

It has been a while since I paid that but I believe the initial cost of the FFL is $200.00 for 3 years. Afterward that the renewal runs $90.00 for 3 years.

The SOT fee for a NFA dealer is $500.00 a year.

A demo letter = This is a letter on official agency letterhead that is requesting a FFL/SOT to obtain a Post 86 machine gun for the purpose of a demonstration to that agency. It must be specific as in Glock 18 9mm machine gun or HK MP5A2 9mm etc.

There are a few FFL/SOTs in Oklahoma that have the Glock 18s. Just need to find one that will allow you to shoot it. I believe at least one of them posts here.

EZ...thanks for asking this question. I've wondered this myself.

So, in the case of a post 86 full auto (say a Glock 18), that is in the possession of a FFL/SOT, what happens if they want to keep the gun "for life"? Would it be possible for them to keep their liscense indefinitely? I assume there is an annual cost to maintain your FFL/SOT liscense...and probably some other requirements. Would anyone mind expounding or linking to some info?

...also, what is a "demo letter"?

...I've drooled over the full auto Glocks for a while now. I realize that without becoming a dealer (not something I plan on doing) I will most likely never be able to own one...however I sure do hope someone brings one to the NFA shoot at USSA (*nudge*hint*nudge*)

 

[CAR-AR-M16]

There are a few FFL/SOTs in Oklahoma that have the Glock 18s. Just need to find one that will allow you to shoot it. I believe at least one of them posts here.

Hmmm.... I wonder who that could be?

[Broken External Image]

 

[jeffsoward]

Okay, I've got a question then;
If the classified that the OP is referring to is trying to sell it as a Pre-May dealer sample. and the classified says that it's owned by a "former C-3 dealer" then the item in question could only be transferred to an FFL/SOT, correct?

 

[CAR-AR-M16]

Okay, I've got a question then;
If the classified that the OP is referring to is trying to sell it as a Pre-May dealer sample. and the classified says that it's owned by a "former C-3 dealer" then the item in question could only be transferred to an FFL/SOT, correct?

You are correct. It is not transferable to an individual.