Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
Latest activity
Classifieds
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Log in
Register
What's New?
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Navigation
Install the app
Install
More Options
Advertise with us
Contact Us
Close Menu
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Forums
The Range
Law & Order
Our Guns are at risk
Search titles only
By:
Reply to Thread
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Message
<blockquote data-quote="henschman" data-source="post: 1613174" data-attributes="member: 4235"><p>Of course rights are not absolute... their limits are drawn by the equal rights of others. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose... or more accurately, at the point at which you would reasonably think that I am about to strike you and could legitimately act in self defense. Your right to free speech certainly includes the right to lie like a rug if you want; but not the right to lie in order to defraud someone, depriving them of their property rights, or to use words in a way that is reasonably likely to be the direct and proximate cause of bodily harm to someone else (like yelling fire in a theater).</p><p></p><p>So when it comes to the right to bear arms, you have to ask yourself the point at which bearing arms becomes a threat to someone else's equal rights. It is hard for me to think of any situation in which the mere carrying of a gun would constitute a violation of anyone's rights, regardless of whether it is carried openly or concealed. The limits of gun rights would be the point at which your conduct causes others to reasonably believe that you are a threat to their rights, such as pointing a gun at innocent people, or brandishing a gun in a threatening way (possibly coupled with threatening speech). You could also violate people's property rights with a gun, such as by shooting bullets into someone else's land or sending sound waves onto their property in a way that impairs their right to use and enjoy it. The ways in which you could violate people's right to be free from the initiation of force with a gun are pretty obvious.</p><p></p><p>But actual violations of people's rights ought to be the only kind of activity that laws prohibit. If they go beyond this role, the laws themselves become a threat to the rights of individuals, giving people a right to defend themselves against the enforcement thereof. A "prior restraint" on a right, such as requiring a license in order to engage in that right, is clearly a violation of people's rights... it is overly broad, and applies to many people who do not and never will threaten anyone else's rights by engaging in the licensed activity.</p><p></p><p>So yes, obviously our gun rights are threatened by many laws. But I agree with you about the CCRKBA... they are shills who try to use groundless fear in order to generate donations and support. They frequently warn about legislation that is proposed perenially and never makes it out of committee, and has no chance of passing. I somehow wound up on the CCRKBA's e-mail list for a long time, and every few days they would come out with another fear-mongering e-mail about how Obama is about to take all our guns and whatnot. </p><p></p><p>The ability to tell when someone is trying to sell you a bill of goods is an eminently vital skill in our society, and is unfortunately not very widely taught. If I had anything to say about it, every kid would take a course on "Spotting BS 101" before he graduates high school (in a voluntary, non-state-supported free market school system in a free society, of course). <img src="/images/smilies/wink.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-shortname=";)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="henschman, post: 1613174, member: 4235"] Of course rights are not absolute... their limits are drawn by the equal rights of others. My right to swing my fist ends at your nose... or more accurately, at the point at which you would reasonably think that I am about to strike you and could legitimately act in self defense. Your right to free speech certainly includes the right to lie like a rug if you want; but not the right to lie in order to defraud someone, depriving them of their property rights, or to use words in a way that is reasonably likely to be the direct and proximate cause of bodily harm to someone else (like yelling fire in a theater). So when it comes to the right to bear arms, you have to ask yourself the point at which bearing arms becomes a threat to someone else's equal rights. It is hard for me to think of any situation in which the mere carrying of a gun would constitute a violation of anyone's rights, regardless of whether it is carried openly or concealed. The limits of gun rights would be the point at which your conduct causes others to reasonably believe that you are a threat to their rights, such as pointing a gun at innocent people, or brandishing a gun in a threatening way (possibly coupled with threatening speech). You could also violate people's property rights with a gun, such as by shooting bullets into someone else's land or sending sound waves onto their property in a way that impairs their right to use and enjoy it. The ways in which you could violate people's right to be free from the initiation of force with a gun are pretty obvious. But actual violations of people's rights ought to be the only kind of activity that laws prohibit. If they go beyond this role, the laws themselves become a threat to the rights of individuals, giving people a right to defend themselves against the enforcement thereof. A "prior restraint" on a right, such as requiring a license in order to engage in that right, is clearly a violation of people's rights... it is overly broad, and applies to many people who do not and never will threaten anyone else's rights by engaging in the licensed activity. So yes, obviously our gun rights are threatened by many laws. But I agree with you about the CCRKBA... they are shills who try to use groundless fear in order to generate donations and support. They frequently warn about legislation that is proposed perenially and never makes it out of committee, and has no chance of passing. I somehow wound up on the CCRKBA's e-mail list for a long time, and every few days they would come out with another fear-mongering e-mail about how Obama is about to take all our guns and whatnot. The ability to tell when someone is trying to sell you a bill of goods is an eminently vital skill in our society, and is unfortunately not very widely taught. If I had anything to say about it, every kid would take a course on "Spotting BS 101" before he graduates high school (in a voluntary, non-state-supported free market school system in a free society, of course). ;) [/QUOTE]
Insert Quotes…
Verification
Post Reply
Forums
The Range
Law & Order
Our Guns are at risk
Search titles only
By:
Top
Bottom