AAA says, "Don't use E-15 ethanol!"

[TwoForFlinching]

Welfare farmers? Really?

You ever owned a farm or worked on one?

You would find out what work is really about.

How is that welfare?

No reason to take offense brother. I am talking about subsidies, which is a huge thing in my neck of the woods. Without subsidies, amongst other things, a lot of these old timers down here would go completely broke paying bills on social security. I grew up on one of them farms

 

[FakeHuman]

Welfare farmers? Really?

You ever owned a farm or worked on one?

You would find out what work is really about.

How is that welfare?

Yeah, the whole "welfare farmer" thing is insulting to the many smaller operators that work long hard hours for little reward other than being your own boss and loving the work that you do. My family farm goes back 4 generations, and never once did we participate in any government subsidy program.

 

[tRidiot]

There are lots of farmers that don't participate in subsidy programs... but obviously, there are a lot that do. Perhaps not in Oklahoma? Corn isn't the biggest crop here, and my understanding is a lot of the subsidies these days are for ethanol production - yet another product that wouldn't be profitable or in any market demand without .gov manipulation and support.

I thought farmers used to grow stuff people wanted/needed and sold it at market to people and companies who would consume it?

 

[TedKennedy]

I thought farmers used to grow stuff people wanted/needed and sold it at market to people and companies who would consume it?

They still do, mostly in Colorado.

 

[TwoForFlinching]

Yeah, the whole "welfare farmer" thing is insulting to the many smaller operators that work long hard hours for little reward other than being your own boss and loving the work that you do. My family farm goes back 4 generations, and never once did we participate in any government subsidy program.

No insult thrown to those who don't take advantage of gov programs. I guess people assume things are the same everywhere based on what they grow up seeing. Subsidy programs like ethanol and crp, insurance fraud, water theft... I don't think the whole farming community is enthralled in it, but I would venture to assume most are blind to it.

 

[turkeyrun]

No reason to take offense brother. I am talking about subsidies, which is a huge thing in my neck of the woods. Without subsidies, amongst other things, a lot of these old timers down here would go completely broke paying bills on social security. I grew up on one of them farms

I'm in your neck of the woods, don't take subsidies or know any who do.
Assuming most do is akin to those saying all gun owners are blood thirty murderers, all LE are JBT, all lawyers are ambulance chasers, all immigrant....., etc. Painting any group with a broad brush on limited knowledge is bound to invoke strong responses.

 

[nofearfactor]

The first time I ever saw any of this corn gas was when I moved to Des Moines Iowa from California summer 1999 before I moved on down to Oklahoma in 2002. I was already paying in the 4s for gas back in northern Cali that summer. The 'corn' gas was cheaper and was becoming the next big thing out in the midwest that summer. I had a turbo Supra and used premium so I tried to stay away from it but my wife used it in her car against my wishes. No surprise finding out that Iowas Sen Grassley was the man helping push the corn industry in Washington- not weird for a dude from a top corn producing state with a university devoted to agriculture bio technology. My first house I bought in Iowa looked out on miles of my neighbors corn fields in all directions.

I found this:
"Corn was on an upswing in 2005 with the expectation that EPA would make refiners use ever-growing amounts of ethanol every year. Back then, oil imports were soaring, gasoline demand was expected to continue to grow, and supporters saw ethanol as a tool for reducing the United States’ reliance on the Middle East while curbing greenhouse gases.

But since then, the North American energy boom has cut the need for Mideast oil, and some green groups have vocally abandoned their support for corn ethanol, blaming the crop for polluting water supplies, wiping out conservation land and even increasing carbon emissions. (Some environmentalists still hold out hope for more “advanced” forms of ethanol, such as those made from corn husks or switch grass.) Pig and cow farmers argue that ethanol drives up the price of their feed, chain restaurateurs complain it makes eating out more expensive, and the powerful oil industry warns that the mandate will drive up gasoline prices.

“Corn ethanol’s brand has been seriously dented in the last 18 months,” said Craig Cox, director of the Ames, Iowa, office of the Environmental Working Group, an environmental organization that opposes the mandate as it’s now structured. “The industry is still very politically well-connected, especially in the Midwest … but it certainly doesn’t occupy the same sort of pedestal that it occupied two years ago.”

Last fall, EPA gave the ethanol industry a scare that showed how much clout corn has lost: For the first time, the agency proposed to cut the amount of ethanol that gasoline refiners must use this year. Biofuel supporters said the move could put a permanent chill in their industry, which they say still provides a much-needed alternative to petroleum."

 

[togap]

If farm subsidies interests you, take a look:http://farm.ewg.org/

 

[n423]

I use non-ethanol in both vehicles and yard equipt.

 

[tRidiot]

I use non-ethanol in both vehicles and yard equipt.

All I use, as long as I can get it. Hate hate hate the few times a year when I'm somewhere I can't find real gas. <sigh>