and in national news.......... Alameda California Emergency response FAIL

[maxim240sx]

Here is "The Deal": ...and its true for most services across the country. If a person is drowning/in flood waters/river/etc., Police/Fire/EMS are to wait for the Water Rescue squad, for two primary reasons- 1) if something goes wrong, the family of the victim may sue, stating that the actions of the "untrained" rescuer(s) contributed to or caused the victim's death, and 2) if the rescuer dies, their family may sue the municipality for inadequate training, leading to the death.

From the perspective of a responder, if you attempt a rescue, and succeed, great, the Dept. gives you a medal and a quiet verbal warning not to do that s**t again. If you fail, you'll definitely be fired, and you may lose your license, if the Dept. goes to the State Board and accuses you of "practice beyond competence". Welfare of my family & waste of education and experience by forced career change, vs. trying to save jerkwad who is trying to kill himself....hmmmmm.

Along with that, its typical Cali/urban America- ZERO personal responsibility. We want to be able to sue if things go wrong, but whine and cry when the resulting protective measures that practioners have to have lead to unintended consequences, and we sure as heck won't do anything "MYSELF!?!?"

This is what chaps my ass about america now days. Everyone wants to sue somebody. SO you do the right thing and you sued in civil court, thats the biggest bunch of BS. I think maybe all the civil attorneys should wade out in that same bay and nobody will save them, then we will have a few less frivolous lawsuits...

 

[grizzly97]

Are first responders trained in hand to hand combat in a water environment?

What does that matter? It said there were roughly 75 people on the beach watching this unfold. Yet not one of them did a damn thing to help the guy! So what if the guy tries to fight you off...it's 6 feet of water! At least do the right thing and at least attempt to help the man! Truly a sad example of our new american society!

 

[MoBoost]

So what if the guy tries to fight you off...it's 6 feet of water!

Unless you are 7-foot-something, 6 feet or 600 feet - you can't touch the bottom. Call me a coward or whatever, but going in there without special training and equipment - would be like trying to catch a "jumper" with your bare hands - you get two dead guys.
Yes, it is sad. Yes, there is a successful suicide in USA every 15 minutes. Yes, the guy needed help before he decided to commit suicide. Expecting a boat on a fire engine is ridicules.

 

[348]

What does that matter? It said there were roughly 75 people on the beach watching this unfold. Yet not one of them did a damn thing to help the guy! So what if the guy tries to fight you off...it's 6 feet of water! At least do the right thing and at least attempt to help the man! Truly a sad example of our new american society!

The guy was obviously committed to follow through with his actions. It wouldn't be much effort to take a first responder or concerned citizen down with him. Everyone keeps saying 6 feet of water like it is nothing until they are at the bottom of it.

 

[RidgeHunter]

No way in Hades would I try to help a man committed to DYING in 6 feet of water.

I think there is a lot of asstalking in this thread. I'm 150 pounds of wuss, but believe you me I could drown myself and anybody on this forum in 6 feet of water if I wanted to. It's hard enough doing a water rescue on a person that want's to live. 150 yards from shore in 6 feet of water. Yeah, it looks a lot safer on paper. Go to the lake with a buddy, get him in 6 feet of water...tell him to beat the ever living sheet out of you as soon as you get close. Have some more folks there to save both of you.

If they couldn't get a boat or something to him, what are they to do? Complain about them not being able to organize or get a boat or something in an hour...but to expect them to go hand to hand with a suicidal man in 6 feet of water is nuts.

Everyone wants to sue somebody.

If it takes all niiiight...

 

[grizzly97]

Unless you are 7-foot-something, 6 feet or 600 feet - you can't touch the bottom. Call me a coward or whatever, but going in there without special training and equipment - would be like trying to catch a "jumper" with your bare hands - you get two dead guys.
Yes, it is sad. Yes, there is a successful suicide in USA every 15 minutes. Yes, the guy needed help before he decided to commit suicide. Expecting a boat on a fire engine is ridicules.

The guy was obviously committed to follow through with his actions. It wouldn't be much effort to take a first responder or concerned citizen down with him. Everyone keeps saying 6 feet of water like it is nothing until they are at the bottom of it.

I guess I just don't understand the "do nothing cause I might get hurt or sued" mentality. Several times I have put myself in danger to help another human being when noone else would. I'm NOT a hero by any stretch, nor am I claiming to be one! I'm just of the belief that if I see someone in peril, I will do what I can to help them, no matter the cost. Because I sure as hell would hope to expect the same in return.


ETA: Yay! Post 1,000! lol.

 

[03on22s]

Here in Stillwater each firehouse has a 14ft aluminum boat for rescues. You'd think that a city that is on the ocean would have something comparable.

 

[RidgeHunter]

Here in Stillwater each firehouse has a 14ft aluminum boat for rescues. You'd think that a city that is on the ocean would have something comparable.

The most ridiculous part of the story to me is nobody could find some kind of boat/raft in an hour to help this guy. Raid the fricken' sporting goods store or something. You'd think a beach would be prepared with something like that. If they had some kind of boat they would have had a good chance.

But going hands on with a suicidal man in 6 feet of water is nuts, and I can't blame anyone for not doing that. It's pretty common for drowning victims that WANT to live to nearly drown their trained rescuers without even trying. Throw in someone trying to die, and that's not taking a risk to save a life...that's a double suicide.

 

[grizzly97]

The most ridiculous part of the story to me is nobody could find some kind of boat/raft in an hour to help this guy. Raid the fricken' sporting goods store or something. You'd think a beach would be prepared with something like that.

Kind of wondering where the lifeguards were. Like you said, it's a beach.

 

[MoBoost]

I'm just of the belief that if I see someone in peril, I will do what I can to help them, no matter the cost. Because I sure as hell would hope to expect the same in return.

Sooooo, when you say "help them" - what exactly do you mean - the only help this guy wanted was to drown quicker. You could also harpoon him, pay for the hospital bill, pay for the psychiatric evaluation, pay for a nice "home" to stay in till the next suicide attempt (you did say no matter the cost).

P.S. Congrats on 1k !!!