Button to Booner

[dennishoddy]

Very interesting article, but I don't see how one can see a spike one year, and an 8 point the next yet claim its the same deer.

I didn't see an ear tag, or anything that would say "this is the same deer"?

 

[DEER 24/7]

idk when i was growing up my dad had 30 head of mama Charolais cattle he knew each and everyone them.To me they were just a bunch of white cattle

 

[dennishoddy]

Cattle have horns that never drop.
Deer have antlers that drop.

 

[Okie4570]

Not sure how they track from the 1.5 to 2.5, from spike to racked deer. I just know I've never seen a spike with a 3.5yo body or older. Surely we'd see some if they always kept that trait. I don't ever shoot spikes, yet the only spikes I ever see are 1.5yo deer.

 

[dennishoddy]

I always thought spikes were 1 1/2 year old deer that were bred in late season. Just my opinion, not biological fact.

I've always questioned these wild deer progressive photo things unless they have an ear tag or something to make sure apples are apples.

 

[Deer Slayer]

There is more to the story than is being told. He keeps good records. I see maybe half of my herd almost daily and can keep track of them. Dennis you should be able too since they are in your yard daily.

 

[dennishoddy]

Even though I have up to a couple dozen deer in the yard year around, I can only tell the big doe, that is the one that was orphaned and hung out in our yard. I posted many pics of that fawn. Now we only think it the same doe as she is the only one that doesn't run when we come up the drive.

I stand by my thoughts that its hard to track a deer without a ear tag or something. Even the example left a lot of something. something to be desired.

 

[Deer Slayer]

Yes, up to 24 would be hard to keep track of. I agree

 

[makeithappen]

I agree, that's an incredible jump from 1.5 to 2.5 in the photos. It's possible, but I feel a bit unlikely. In the area I hunt, there'a usually a bunch of spikes and 4 points that barely have points 3/4. The next year, you'll see quite a few basket 8's and several 6 points that are right at the ears. After that, they tend to spread out territorially, but I've seen large 8s, 10s and my 11 point. Very few non-typical deer prior to this season.

 

[huntemup]

Not sure how they track from the 1.5 to 2.5, from spike to racked deer. I just know I've never seen a spike with a 3.5yo body or older. Surely we'd see some if they always kept that trait. I don't ever shoot spikes, yet the only spikes I ever see are 1.5yo deer.

Really? Because I've seen plenty. Except where I come when they get that old, we no longer call them spikes but rather we refer to them as cowhorn deer because the two antlers are much taller than a typical spike and they bell out. We kill them as cull bucks.


Also, with regards to spikes becoming something better down the road. Sure it might happen, but they will almost always be behind other deer in their age who had forked antlers their first year. There have been several studies done to confirm this with controlled groups of deer - not simply posting pics of deer saying he was this and now he's this.



In January, 1983, five buck fawns sired by a fork-antlered yearling buck and five buck fawns sired by a spike-antlered yearling sire were permanently marked by freeze branding, ear tagged, and released into a 96-acre experimental pasture at approximately six months of age. Each year, in October, all bucks were captured, weighed, and antler measurements obtained. Antler measurements included main beam spread, main beam length, basal circumference, number of points, and antler weight."

Trend analysis: "Antler development and body weights between the two populations of deer based on the sire line from 1.5 to 4.5 years of age are shown in Figures 1-6. Although there is no statistical difference between the means of the two populations of deer by sire line, there is a definite separation in trends of the two population means for all parameter measurements, with the fork-antlered sire line always being superior to the spike-antlered sire line."
https://tpwd.texas.gov/huntwild/wild/game_management/deer/spikes_not_inferior/


and here's an even better, much more in depth study about antler growth/potential when it comes to spikes vs their multi point yearling counter parts.

https://tpwd.texas.gov/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_rp_w7000_0827.pdf



Bottom line is that they may end up as something you'd want on your wall, but by and large they don't have the genes you want in your deer herd if you're trying to manage for quality bucks. THe longer you let them walk, the more of your resources they're taking up that could go towards better deer, but more important, the better chance they have of spreading their inferior genes. If You kill the nice quality bucks and keep letting the spikes walk during the rut, guess who ends up breeding your does esp in those late season secondary rut breedings.