You know I was just thinking it was you that told me that - I'll consider it true then man - wasn't trying to question you, just forgot where I heard it.
You know I was just thinking it was you that told me that - I'll consider it true then man - wasn't trying to question you, just forgot where I heard it.
I've been reading more than I care to remember about the MSAR STG vs AUG A3 vs TPD AXR. Here's the general consensus I've come up with. The MSAR offering as currently defined is a great gun. They had some problems in the early going (not unexpected for a brand new product, not to mention brand new product line). MSAR as a company has consistantly been reputed as a star for customer service by really stepping out to help their owners. The new gen4 rifles are supposed to be top notch incorporating all the revisions required to solve the problems in the previous three. While I haven't seen failure rate numbers, knowing the internet using public generally is more vocal when things are wrong rather than right, it doesn't seem like they were terrible to begin with. While the MSAR looks, feels, and shoots like an AUG, it's not an AUG. It's a completely new gun sharing only a few interchangeable parts. Time will tell whether they built a better mouse trap but it doesn't seem like they built a worse one so far.
The TPD AXR at first blush seemed like a possible best of bread as they were most closely aligned in design with the original AUG for better or worse. However there isn't much out there on them as they seem to be in infinite backorder. I liked the idea of using GI mags so I don't have to support multiple versions especially in a shtf scenario. But the MSAR now offers a version and I believe Steyr is as well (iirc) that runs those mags. I have read the MSAR does have feed problems with them on some guns though. The price is also quite a bit higher now on the AXR if you can find one at all.
Then there's the venerable AUG. The purist in me wants the original Steyr. This is the gun that sets the standard. And it doesn't matter if a clone is better or worse, this is the measuring stick for a reason.
After reading all this, I've come to this conclusion for my own purposes. If I ask myself why I want an AUG (and I have since seeing the original Die Hard), it's because they are crazy, sexy, cool. Nothing is neater than a bullpup and no one makes it look better than the AUG (and clones). At the range, I don't think I would do any better with the AUG than I would with my M4. SHTF? I'd pick up which ever was closest. So that leaves me with the fundimental understanding that the AUG is a different shooting gun but mostly, it flat looks cool.
Not considering the AXR, I'm left with a grand for an STG or 2300 for Properly named AUG. From what I've read from people who have shot and own both is they are both great guns. Some like some features on the STG better. Others like the purity of a AUG with Steyr printed on the side. Still others happily run their cheaper STGs while keeping their more collectible AUGs in the safe. I didn't find really anything that the STG was a worse gun to take to the range or out back and pop varmints with.
So now I must ask myself, "is it worth an extra 1300 for the name?" Maybe. But I don't intend to own two of each like some of these guys do. Whatever I chose, I'm only going to own one for the foreseeable future. So I ultimately decided the STG fit the bill better. I could own two plus some odds and ends for the price of one Steyr. I haven't read anything that convinced me that the current rifles would be unreliable and if they are, MSAR has convinced me they will take care of the problem. I read a couple stories about LEs buying them for their duty weapons after reviewing them. I also like the looks of the MSAR top rail better (imho). So given the price difference and my real motivation is to run a different style of gun, I'm going to take a chance on the STG and see how it goes.
That said, I'm wondering who sells them locally. I called H&H here in OKC but they were at 1800 which is about 800 more than the online guys are charging. I don't mind paying a bit more to support the local guys but not nearly double the price. Anyone selling them closer to the newer pricing MSAR just released?
The TPD AXR at first blush seemed like a possible best of bread as they were most closely aligned in design with the original AUG for better or worse. However there isn't much out there on them as they seem to be in infinite backorder. I liked the idea of using GI mags so I don't have to support multiple versions especially in a shtf scenario. But the MSAR now offers a version and I believe Steyr is as well (iirc) that runs those mags. I have read the MSAR does have feed problems with them on some guns though. The price is also quite a bit higher now on the AXR if you can find one at all.
Then there's the venerable AUG. The purist in me wants the original Steyr. This is the gun that sets the standard. And it doesn't matter if a clone is better or worse, this is the measuring stick for a reason.
After reading all this, I've come to this conclusion for my own purposes. If I ask myself why I want an AUG (and I have since seeing the original Die Hard), it's because they are crazy, sexy, cool. Nothing is neater than a bullpup and no one makes it look better than the AUG (and clones). At the range, I don't think I would do any better with the AUG than I would with my M4. SHTF? I'd pick up which ever was closest. So that leaves me with the fundimental understanding that the AUG is a different shooting gun but mostly, it flat looks cool.
Not considering the AXR, I'm left with a grand for an STG or 2300 for Properly named AUG. From what I've read from people who have shot and own both is they are both great guns. Some like some features on the STG better. Others like the purity of a AUG with Steyr printed on the side. Still others happily run their cheaper STGs while keeping their more collectible AUGs in the safe. I didn't find really anything that the STG was a worse gun to take to the range or out back and pop varmints with.
So now I must ask myself, "is it worth an extra 1300 for the name?" Maybe. But I don't intend to own two of each like some of these guys do. Whatever I chose, I'm only going to own one for the foreseeable future. So I ultimately decided the STG fit the bill better. I could own two plus some odds and ends for the price of one Steyr. I haven't read anything that convinced me that the current rifles would be unreliable and if they are, MSAR has convinced me they will take care of the problem. I read a couple stories about LEs buying them for their duty weapons after reviewing them. I also like the looks of the MSAR top rail better (imho). So given the price difference and my real motivation is to run a different style of gun, I'm going to take a chance on the STG and see how it goes.
That said, I'm wondering who sells them locally. I called H&H here in OKC but they were at 1800 which is about 800 more than the online guys are charging. I don't mind paying a bit more to support the local guys but not nearly double the price. Anyone selling them closer to the newer pricing MSAR just released?
is that a promise?
There are two gun shows the next two weekends at the fairgrounds, you might be able to find a cheaper deal. Of late I have only seen one dealer with one and I rather go to H&H to get one.
I personally hate on MSAR just cause
Other place I would look for brand new is Ratworx, as of Christmas time all MSAR guns and accessories were half off. Petes of PJ investments is top of the list as well, followed by The Specialist.
Ratworx
http://www.ratworxusa.com/
The Specialist
http://www.specialistgunshop.com/main.html
PJs
http://www.pjs-steyraug.com/
Wow just looking MSAR will be coming out with a pistol version of the rifle that takes Glock mags. So if you want to play with 9mm, 45 acp and what not that is possible now. Steyr has yet to reintroduce the 9mm version of the AUG
I personally hate on MSAR just cause
Other place I would look for brand new is Ratworx, as of Christmas time all MSAR guns and accessories were half off. Petes of PJ investments is top of the list as well, followed by The Specialist.Ratworx
http://www.ratworxusa.com/
The Specialist
http://www.specialistgunshop.com/main.html
PJs
http://www.pjs-steyraug.com/
Wow just looking MSAR will be coming out with a pistol version of the rifle that takes Glock mags. So if you want to play with 9mm, 45 acp and what not that is possible now. Steyr has yet to reintroduce the 9mm version of the AUG
It's ok, I like the hate. 
I've been eyeballing ratworx for a bit but hadn't seen the others. Thanks for the links! I swung by H&H this weekend and they had an A3 and two MSARs in th cabinets. The a3 was on the high side of reasonable at 2200 (online pricing seems to be in the 1900-2k range) and if I were in the market for a 2k gun I'd probably buy it local to show the local guys the love. But they were at around 2k on both the MSARs and I ask the guy why they were twice the price of the online stores and he just shut the case and told me it wouldn't break his heart if I bought somewhere else. I wasn't rude with my question but was a little put off by the answer. My guess is they are presale guns and they had them priced at presale msrp and were hoping to get rid of them without a loss. I'm all about supporting the local guys but not to the tune of an extra grand.
Anyway, might be giving ratworx a call in a few days.
I've been eyeballing ratworx for a bit but hadn't seen the others. Thanks for the links! I swung by H&H this weekend and they had an A3 and two MSARs in th cabinets. The a3 was on the high side of reasonable at 2200 (online pricing seems to be in the 1900-2k range) and if I were in the market for a 2k gun I'd probably buy it local to show the local guys the love. But they were at around 2k on both the MSARs and I ask the guy why they were twice the price of the online stores and he just shut the case and told me it wouldn't break his heart if I bought somewhere else. I wasn't rude with my question but was a little put off by the answer. My guess is they are presale guns and they had them priced at presale msrp and were hoping to get rid of them without a loss. I'm all about supporting the local guys but not to the tune of an extra grand.
Anyway, might be giving ratworx a call in a few days.
Didn't see anything like that. I saw what looked like a couple 2nd or 3rd gen OD green ones and the A3 piled in the case.
Sounds pretty cool! I'm just looking for a for a stock one that I won't feel bad about putting some rounds through. I baby my desert eagle now and it's fun but I think I'm going to sell it to consolidate ammo requirements.
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