Keep an eye on whats going on in Virginia.

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ConstitutionCowboy

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While this pending situation is not equivocal to the Athens, Tennessee, 'revolt' in 1946, it does show to lawmakers what a large segment of the population can do when you step on their rights, subvert the Constitution, and make them vulnerable to dictatorial despotic jackbooted rule. We have constitutions proscribed to prevent this sort of stuff, and when the constitutions are not abided, those constitutions support the ability of the citizenry to throw of such abhorrent governance. We the People reserve the right to cleanse the halls of government when those in those halls deign it upon themselves to assume superiority, and diminish the people into dutiful obedience. When that begins, it is time to take up arms and not surrender them, for when the people lack the means to uphold their rights, they are nothing more than villein.

I don't care whether these legislators and governor intend to subjugate the people of Virginia or not, their acts and actions will make the people vulnerable to someone or some ones who will. That right there is just egregious as if they desired it for themselves.

Woody
 

Tanis143

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I agree, it would be handy, but would quickly be ferreted out, in my opinion. It would take only a very few instances of folks being tipped off before they would get phone records (legally or otherwise) to pin down the officer(s) doing it. That would lead to even more problems. The network is just too pervasive these days. It wouldn't take long...

Sorry man, but it is so easy to pass info without detection that insiders could do it while the jackboot thugs were in the same room and STILL go undetected. Encrypted email, anonymous FB accounts, plethora of different messaging platforms, hell IRC is still around and can be accessed from a phone app. All it would take is a hidden burner phone, a VPN, or even using a free wifi hotspot to transmit intel in a way that would never be traced back to the sender. The only way a person would get caught is if they were dumb.
 

tRidiot

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Sorry man, but it is so easy to pass info without detection that insiders could do it while the jackboot thugs were in the same room and STILL go undetected. Encrypted email, anonymous FB accounts, plethora of different messaging platforms, hell IRC is still around and can be accessed from a phone app. All it would take is a hidden burner phone, a VPN, or even using a free wifi hotspot to transmit intel in a way that would never be traced back to the sender. The only way a person would get caught is if they were dumb.

Lots of people are plenty dumb, and I still don't think it would be nearly as difficult to trace some or most of those methods as most people think. When you start talking about 'national security' and resisting firearms laws, I think you would see more use of some of those methods the alphabet agencies don't make common knowledge. Burner phones aren't nearly as secure as people think when someone is specifically watching for them - which would happen quickly after a few botched raids.
 

Tanis143

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Lots of people are plenty dumb, and I still don't think it would be nearly as difficult to trace some or most of those methods as most people think. When you start talking about 'national security' and resisting firearms laws, I think you would see more use of some of those methods the alphabet agencies don't make common knowledge. Burner phones aren't nearly as secure as people think when someone is specifically watching for them - which would happen quickly after a few botched raids.

No matter how tight a net national security weaves, there will always be holes. A burner phone is useful not just for phone calls. Hell, buy an old smartphone on craigslist, don't activate it but use public wifi hotspots to send messages through one of the various messaging apps out there. Unless the person is caught with that phone there would be no way to trace it back to them. Especially when there are so many ways to break into even secured 2.4 ghz wireless networks. Drive to an apartment complex, either find an unsecured (there are plenty still out there) wifi network or force entry into an older router, send the info, then leave.

The only way I could see them preventing this is if they sequestered the entire force that was doing door to door confiscations and permit them no access to any phone, computer or tablet. And that would make for some pretty low moral, which probably cause even more to turn to the pro-2A side.
 

Glocktogo

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I agree, it would be handy, but would quickly be ferreted out, in my opinion. It would take only a very few instances of folks being tipped off before they would get phone records (legally or otherwise) to pin down the officer(s) doing it. That would lead to even more problems. The network is just too pervasive these days. It wouldn't take long...

INFOSEC goes both ways. :)
 

tRidiot

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The only way I could see them preventing this is if they sequestered the entire force that was doing door to door confiscations and permit them no access to any phone, computer or tablet. And that would make for some pretty low moral, which probably cause even more to turn to the pro-2A side.

Really? How hard could it be???

Action team told to show up for work on Monday.
Monday at 8AM, pulled into a room, personal cell phones confiscated or left in a lockbox in squadroom.
Team given an address, a name and list of items/firearms suspected, other important info (occupants, etc.).
"Everyone out and into the MRAP, we leave in 5."
Roll out to address to serve warrant.
Anyone refusing to participate placed on unpaid leave pending review.
Subsequent termination.
Wash, rinse, repeat.

Is this a farfetched scenario, or any different than the SWAT/HRT teams in major cities do every day? Not at all...
 

Tanis143

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Really? How hard could it be???

Action team told to show up for work on Monday.
Monday at 8AM, pulled into a room, personal cell phones confiscated or left in a lockbox in squadroom.
Team given an address, a name and list of items/firearms suspected, other important info (occupants, etc.).
"Everyone out and into the MRAP, we leave in 5."
Roll out to address to serve warrant.
Anyone refusing to participate placed on unpaid leave pending review.
Subsequent termination.
Wash, rinse, repeat.

Is this a farfetched scenario, or any different than the SWAT/HRT teams in major cities do every day? Not at all...

Who said it had to be someone on the action team? Those orders get filtered down and there are plenty of opportunities for someone to leak them.

Honestly, we could sit here and go tit for tat on ideas. The point is that if someone wanted to inform others of an upcoming raid/arrest it is possible for them to do so without being caught.
 

tRidiot

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Who said it had to be someone on the action team? Those orders get filtered down and there are plenty of opportunities for someone to leak them.

Honestly, we could sit here and go tit for tat on ideas. The point is that if someone wanted to inform others of an upcoming raid/arrest it is possible for them to do so without being caught.

I never said it was impossible. Just saying there are plenty of ways to both catch all but the most careful and tech savvy moles (and 95+% of the LEOs I know wouldn't have a clue about half the stuff you were talking about) as well as maintaining security. None of it's rocket surgery.
 

CHenry

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Who said it had to be someone on the action team? Those orders get filtered down and there are plenty of opportunities for someone to leak them.

Honestly, we could sit here and go tit for tat on ideas. The point is that if someone wanted to inform others of an upcoming raid/arrest it is possible for them to do so without being caught.
Absolutely agree.
 

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