Here's another great option. Probably the best option out there.
I can build up a Police Magnum identical to the Wilson combat for 2/3 to 1/2 the cost. It just doesn't say "Wilson Combat" on the side.
I remember seeing a few threads you've posted here with some of your shotgun work. Are you doing any internal work the on the gun or just adding the WC parts? I've seen how rough the express models can be compared to a Police Magnum or an old Wingmaster and can imagine how much they would benefit from a makeover. Other than adding a few external parts and a nice durable finish, it's difficult for me to imagine there's much room for improvement on a 870P.
And because I like talking shotguns with you all so much I wanted to share this link to Greg Ellifritz' blog article about shotguns for home defense. http://www.activeresponsetraining.n...veResponseTraining+(Active+Response+Training)
From the top of my head, the 870P has: Parkerized finish, non-MIM extractor, heavier springs in the trigger group, aluminum trigger guard without safety lock and non-dimpled magazine tube. The design is the same. A lot of people who don't know the difference think the matte blue found on the express is parkerized. Everything can be easily modified or changed except for the finish. And you're right, it's hard to beat a Police 870.
The biggest myths on HD shotguns is the load and pattern size. Overpenetration VS small shot, what choke to use, etc. Everyone should take their shotgun to the range and pace off their particular HD distance, then shoot the target with #8 birdshot. Birdshot is absolutely devastating at typical HD distances. People would be surprised at the small size of the shot column at 21 feet. (Yes, that's 7 yards for those of you with big houses and loooong halls.). At the other extreme, with controlled expansion 00Buck, all 9 pellets (2-3/4" shells) will/can stay inside of an 8" paper plate at distances from 15 up to 20 and sometimes 25 yards. Everything else can/will be somewhere in between.
The only absolute I've found is that you have to take the time and spend the money and practice and train for your particular application to figure out what works for you and what doesn't. There is no magical unicorn of one gun and one load for everyone and everything.
I'll save the debate as to why everyone wants a 3" magnum VS an old skool 2-3/4" Wingmaster for later. The perfect host is the "beater" $150 pawn shop 2-3/4" Wingmaster that's ugly as sin but smooth as butter.
YMMV, My .02c worth........
The biggest myths on HD shotguns is the load and pattern size. Overpenetration VS small shot, what choke to use, etc. Everyone should take their shotgun to the range and pace off their particular HD distance, then shoot the target with #8 birdshot. Birdshot is absolutely devastating at typical HD distances. People would be surprised at the small size of the shot column at 21 feet. (Yes, that's 7 yards for those of you with big houses and loooong halls.). At the other extreme, with controlled expansion 00Buck, all 9 pellets (2-3/4" shells) will/can stay inside of an 8" paper plate at distances from 15 up to 20 and sometimes 25 yards. Everything else can/will be somewhere in between.
The only absolute I've found is that you have to take the time and spend the money and practice and train for your particular application to figure out what works for you and what doesn't. There is no magical unicorn of one gun and one load for everyone and everything.
I'll save the debate as to why everyone wants a 3" magnum VS an old skool 2-3/4" Wingmaster for later. The perfect host is the "beater" $150 pawn shop 2-3/4" Wingmaster that's ugly as sin but smooth as butter.
YMMV, My .02c worth........
Birdshot is just about the worst HD round there is. It will make a nice 1.5" hole that won't penetrate the human sternum. People'd be better served with a Gamo pellet gun or a Jimenez .25acp.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.thet.../shotgun-penetration-with-various-rounds/amp/
Better not tell that to my buddy that carry's a couple of #7.5 pellets in his heart muscle and some more in his lungs from a hunting accident at 30 yds. Early season dove hunt with a tshirt on. The ribs and sternum stopped most, but some got between. Dr's chose to leave them in place.
Yes, he lived, and I agree birdshot is a poor choice, but at close ranges like a hallway, its a solid ball of lead for the most part.
Question for the HD pump gun folks.
How are you going to pump the action when you have most of one arm shot off or broken in a fight by an intruder?
I had an AT-600 Police only Mossy pump gun with 3" chambers, drilled and tapped for scope, and thought it was the epitome of HD guns. Danged forearm would pop off using the 3" rounds and had ejection issues. I wasn't as familiar with firearms at the time and put it in the safe to be stolen later with other guns.
I still don't see how one thinks the smoothest running pump gun would be better than an auto loader that can be shot with one hand?
These threads only talk about what pump gun is the smoothest and don't address what might really happen in a home invasion where there is a fight, and later an opportunity to get to a shotgun and use it, possibly one handed.
How are you going to pump the action when you have most of one arm shot off or broken in a fight by an intruder?
I had an AT-600 Police only Mossy pump gun with 3" chambers, drilled and tapped for scope, and thought it was the epitome of HD guns. Danged forearm would pop off using the 3" rounds and had ejection issues. I wasn't as familiar with firearms at the time and put it in the safe to be stolen later with other guns.
I still don't see how one thinks the smoothest running pump gun would be better than an auto loader that can be shot with one hand?
These threads only talk about what pump gun is the smoothest and don't address what might really happen in a home invasion where there is a fight, and later an opportunity to get to a shotgun and use it, possibly one handed.
I think it's mostly affordability. They are also very reliable. That said I've looked off and on for a cheap old beater 12ga A5 Browning over the years. Haven't found one cheap enough, everybody seems to think they are ALL collectable. My idea is to cut it down in the stock about 3" and put a pad on it. Then chop the barrel to 18" and get an extended tube for it made. Clyde Barrow was murdering scum but he did know his weapons.
I don't disagree, but does the cheapest shotgun on the market make one feel good about their safety? Does the fact you have to have two hands to make it work make it the best self defense gun for a home? I don't think so.
Pet peeve of mine and wonder how anybody can justify their position using a pump gun for HD.
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