Warrantless search - Rogers County

[THAT Gurl]

@tweetr - I hope your son rehabilitates himself and no longer pursues criminal interests. I'm sure Rogers County is much safer now that he's been investigated at the roadside.

If you want to amuse yourself you might check out studies on drug dogs taking cues, it's a thing.

Also check and see how many of those studies indicated that the cueing was unintentional by the officer. "Problem" is dogs are MUCH smarter than we are and they learn what we want -- and they give it to us in exchange for the reward we give them.

 

[THAT Gurl]

Just like politicians sealing documents, there's a reason someone doesn't want light shined on the evidence.

As much as I despise the system that allows bad cops to abuse their power, I honestly believe that body cam evidence would show most of their interactions to be valid, with a lot of BS by suspects proven to be false.

That said, I had an ex-cop tell me not long ago, that back in "his day" they didn't have cameras, and would beat down a driver that talked smack to them. Looked me in the eye and said it and was apparently proud that his armed self, with assistance from his partner would deliver a beating over a verbal altercation. I know, I know, he's probably the only one....

If only ...

 

[Snattlerake]

Hah!
I'm out here in Phoenix prepping the jet for passengers and the ramp at Cutter Aviation "smells strongly of weed!"
Go figure.

That's funny, it is snowing in Phoenix.

https://cutteraviation.com/fbo-services/airport-facility-locations-phx-phoenix-sky-harbor-az/

 

[trekrok]

Also check and see how many of those studies indicated that the cueing was unintentional by the officer. "Problem" is dogs are MUCH smarter than we are and they learn what we want -- and they give it to us in exchange for the reward we give them.

I've always wondered about that. The idea the dog doesn't figure out 'hey, when I go ape s**t on this thing I get a treat/ball' seems silly. I don't know how they train them, but it would surprise me if the dog hadn't figured out how to game the system.

 

[Snattlerake]

That said, I had an ex-cop tell me not long ago, that back in "his day" they didn't have cameras, and would beat down a driver that talked smack to them. Looked me in the eye and said it and was apparently proud that his armed self, with assistance from his partner would deliver a beating over a verbal altercation. I know, I know, he's probably the only one....

That really torques my nut! What years was he a cop? 50's 60's? I would have paid to have a body camera. In fact, I used a microcassette recorder on all my stops. It was better than nothing.

 

[OK Corgi Rancher]

Yep... I used a recorder, too. I would've gladly worn a body cam had they been available. I can't tell you the number of times I was accused of something I didn't do by sweet, innocent little Joe Citizen. Like I said in an earlier post...it ain't just the cops that lie. People will say and do nearly anything, without regard for how it might affect someone else, if they think it will get them out of trouble.

Kind of along the same lines as embellishing a story to gain sympathy and validation from others.

 

[THAT Gurl]

I've always wondered about that. The idea the dog doesn't figure out 'hey, when I go ape s**t on this thing I get a treat/ball' seems silly. I don't know how they train them, but it would surprise me if the dog hadn't figured out how to game the system.

That is EXACTLY it. They choose these dogs on their ability to make decisions based on their training -- that is why Malinois and some lines of German Shepherds make such horrible pets. They need a strong owner who is willing to keep them busy. They may respond to your leadership but they are oftentimes smarter than their handler. Just the nature of those breeds.

 

[okcBob]

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/05/01/federal-judge-has-serious/
Do OK dogs have to pass double blind training?

 

[OK Corgi Rancher]

Information regard the effectiveness of drug dogs is all over the place. There are studies that say they're highly reliable and studies that say they're highly unreliable and studies that say they're in between.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24631776/

Abstract​

Some recent publications claim that the effectiveness of police canine drug detection is uncertain and likely minimal, and that the deterrent effect of dogs on drug users is low. It is also claimed that more scientific evidence is needed to demonstrate to what extent dogs actually detect drugs. The aim of this research was to assess experimentally, but in actual training and testing environments used by the Polish police, how effective dogs trained by the police were at illicit substance detection depending on factors such as type of drug, dog breed, dog experience with the searching site, and drug odor residuals. 68 Labrador retrievers, 61 German shepherds, 25 Terriers and 10 English Cocker Spaniels, of both sexes in each breed, were used. Altogether 1219 experimental searching tests were conducted. On average, hidden drug samples were indicated by dogs after 64s searching time, with 87.7% indications being correct and 5.3% being false. In 7.0% of trials dogs failed to find the drug sample within 10min. The ranking of drugs from the easiest to the most difficult to detect was: marijuana, hashish, amphetamine, cocaine, heroin. German shepherds were superior to other breeds in giving correct indications while Terriers showed relatively poor detection performance. Dogs were equally efficient at searching in well-known vs. unknown rooms with strange (i.e., non-target novelty) odors (83.2% correct indications), but they were less accurate when searching outside or inside cars (63.5% and 57.9% correct indications respectively). During police examination trials the dogs made more false alerts, fewer correct indications and searching time was longer compared to the final stage of the training. The drug odor may persist at a site for at least 48h. Our experiments do not confirm the recent reports, based on drug users' opinions, of low drug detection efficiency. Usefulness of drug detection dogs has been demonstrated here, even if their effectiveness may not be 100%, but different factors have to be taken into consideration to assure maximum effectiveness.

 

[TedKennedy]

That really torques my nut! What years was he a cop? 50's 60's? I would have paid to have a body camera. In fact, I used a microcassette recorder on all my stops. It was better than nothing.

70s and 80s up until early 90s.