Choctaw Casino Durant

[Glock 40]

So Thor is there a government standard that a Machine must pay out a certain percentage? Also your saying the casinos can set limits per machine so they could theoretically have looser machines at the door or in certain places. For example 30 identical looking machines but 2 are set to higher payout rates? Sorry to drag you back in.

 

[Snattlerake]

Yeah, it wouldn't have been because they paid out too much. Believe me, those games are tested to standards that'd blow your mind. Mathematical tests are done into the billions of spins to determine the overall theoretical holds that a game will have, and that is documented in amazing detail well before any particular theme ever is approved for use in any particular gaming jurisdiction. There is one reason and one reason only that your favorite game would've been removed from the casino - it didn't get as much play as another game would in it's place. From my time when I was the person on the casino floor doing this work, I'd be an amazingly wealthy man now if I had a buck for every time I heard from a particular casino guest that whatever game I was removing, changing, etc. was their favorite game. It may have been their favorite, but it wasn't the favorite of enough people to make it worth keeping.

Think of it this way, (and these are BS numbers conjured from thin air):
Most casinos on earth track performance through a few metrics, but most widely reference is WPU (Win Per Unit). That's simply a measurement of how much cash and free play was physically put in a game that day, and how much money that game physically cashed out that day. Lets say there was $1000 cash and $50 free play put in to that game on a particular day. It cashed out $800 that day, generating a profit of $150 for that game (after deducting the free play), for that particular day. Let's say the house average is $300 per day, but your game only made $150 while those around it made $300, or even more. Take those daily numbers, run them out for a few months, and average it's WPU for that time against the house average. Standard procedure is to convert the title, or change the cabinet entirely to a game that is more popular. It's as simple as that as to why games are changed or removed. Analytics can get very complicated, very quickly, but that's an easy metric to use to determine the level of success of a game.


Haha. FYI - almost all companies in the gaming industry use acronyms for their names. VGT, AGS, IGT, SG, ATI, etc. VGT stands for Video Gaming Technologies. They are a manufacturer and operator. They were bought out last year by one of the companies we do business with. VGT makes very simple, but pretty fun games and are very popular in this part of the country.

WMS used to be Williams Gaming. They were another very large manufacturer of slot machines. They were bought by Bally Gaming (now known as SG Gaming) who is another slot machine manufacturer.


I think he was referring to an investment opportunity from a player's perspective. That's how I took it.

OK, seriously, I promise I'm done writing slot machine mini-novels! Any and all assumptions about how casinos operate are entirely and completely accurate moving forward, and will not meet any rebuke on from me!

Rebuke? More like education about the gaming systems in place and the regulatory system for them. It reinforces my belief gambling is a tax on the mathematically challenged.

 

[ignerntbend]

Not an optimal investment opportunity? That's why there are thousands of them?

Not an optimal investment opportunity? That's why there are thousands of them?

I should have clarified that.
It’s great for the guy that owns the machine.

 

[Glock 40]

Rebuke? More like education about the gaming systems in place and the regulatory system for them. It reinforces my belief gambling is a tax on the mathematically challenged.

I think you mean stupid tax.

 

[thor447]

So Thor is the government standard that a Machine must pay out a certain percentage? Also your saying the casinos can set limits per machine so they could theoretically have looser machines at the door or in certain places. For example 30 identical looking machines but 2 are set to higher payout rates? Sorry to drag you back in.

No, there isn’t a legal standard that says all machines must pay at X amount. There are industry norms that just about everything falls in to, and different theories on when to set things higher or lower. Then there are tons of other factors that go into it which I will not elaborate on.

Your other question, yes. Just like why grocery stores always put the milk in the very back! I am not at all saying that the best paying machines are in the back of the casino. That’s not the case at all. You could have 50 games in a row all identical from the outside, but two or three could theoretically be set to pay out higher or lower than others. It’s easily within the realm of what’s possible. There may be reasons to do this. If you were an Slots Manager, wouldn’t you think that it might make sense to temporarily set half the machines on a bank of games at 90%, then the other half at 92%? Analyze the numbers after about a week and see which one is more popular. See which one gets more play throughout the day. 2% doesn’t sound like much, but depending upon the game mechanics, it can greatly affect the players experience. On top of games and service, those types of analytics are what companies like mine can offer. Certain casinos rely on us entirely for analytics, others like to be very much involved, which I feel is a good thing. We can show them analytics and offer suggestions on the best way to move forward with any particular product. We have a pretty good record, and I personally feel we are the best at it.

To make a long story short though, if the game doesn’t pay, people won’t play it. You could set a game to pay at 80% if there was an option to do it that low. Some casinos think that’ll make way more money by tightening the games up that much, but the reality of it is that someone will play it once, but never again because it wasn’t fun. Their experience would be soured on that slot title entirely, and not just that individual game because they think they are all the same.

Certain games may make the casino more money paying out at 94% then they would at 90%, just because of the sheer volume of play that they get. All the coolest graphics, sounds, and lights in the world won’t make it fun if you put in $100, spin it 200 times, and lose on every spin. Certain mechanics of gameplay change the higher or lower you raise that hold percentage, wins happen more frequently or less frequently, bonuses happen more often or less often, it all varies by the individual game’s math. It’s measured as a volatility rating. The higher the volatility of a particular game, the less spins will win, but those individual wins will be higher. The lower the volatility, the more spins will win, but the less amount won each time. That’s two very different ways to equal the same overall payout percentage and it may greatly affect how fun or boring a game is to play. There’s just so many other things than just the overall percentage a game pays out.


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[thor447]

It reinforces my belief gambling is a tax on the mathematically challenged.

That’s funny! But every once in a while a squirrel does get a nut!


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[thor447]

OK, I’m sitting down to watch Extraction on Netflix. See you all tomorrow!


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[swampratt]

Boring I have a theory as to why your luck sank today.
You took pictures of your good luck charms and posted them.

If you take a picture of something like an animal or person you take some of their soul.
I feel with your bragging and picture taking you have left your lucky charms in a bad mood and removed a lot of their soul.

Shouldn't have done that.

 

[Boring]

Boring I have a theory as to why your luck sank today.
You took pictures of your good luck charms and posted them.

If you take a picture of something like an animal or person you take some of their soul.
I feel with your bragging and picture taking you have left your lucky charms in a bad mood and removed a lot of their soul.

Shouldn't have done that.

Yes. I concur. I came off as overconfident, brash. I have been humbled.

 

[ignerntbend]

Boring I have a theory as to why your luck sank today.
You took pictures of your good luck charms and posted them.

If you take a picture of something like an animal or person you take some of their soul.
I feel with your bragging and picture taking you have left your lucky charms in a bad mood and removed a lot of their soul.

Shouldn't have done that.

Best theory so far.