Ram's new EcoDiesel

[Okie4570]

I own 3 diesel trucks, so I feel I'm speaking from experience when I say this. Diesel engines have been ruined by EPA regulations. Gas is the cheaper option.

Gas engines these days last for as long or longer than their diesel counterparts. The days of million mile diesels are gone. Being a pipeline welder who uses his truck for work, most everyone I know drives diesel trucks. Most of them are lucky to get 200k miles out of them. Diesels are more expensive to service and maintain. When you lose an injector, you can replace an entire gas engine for the money it would cost to replace just your fuel injectors on a diesel. I recently lost an injector in my 05 dodge, and although I spent 3k and replaced them within a week of noticing I had a problem, the damage to that cylinder was already done and it is currently getting a rebuild for 6k. That will 9k spent on that truck for one bad injector. That pricing is assuming everything else on the engine is still good, which with only 130k miles I hope I'm getting off easy.

This new diesel will also require Diesel Exhaust Fluid, so don't forget to factor the cost of filling that tank when figuring your mileage savings. You also have to really stay on top of your filtration. Letting your fuel filter go to long without changing it can let a tiny speck of dirt pass through and destroy a high pressure injector, leading to further engine damage. If you let your air filter go too long, you can let dirt through to dust and kill your turbo as well.

If you factor in the extra up front cost of a diesel at purchase, combined with the higher price of the fuel at the pump, plus the extra maintenance and repair costs, you will see that unless you actually need that extra low end power for pulling heavy loads, which you won't be doing with a 1500, diesel is just a bad buy.

I've got 321k on a 03' 6.0l powerstoke, that's given me very little trouble, all major parts are still orignial (turbo, half the injectors, tranny, transfer case, rear end, wiring harness, etc) probably 75% dirt roads/25% highway. 02' Excursion witha 7.3l.......same story. My next truck won't be a diesel, IMO if you don't pull with your truck everyday and need the torque, it's not worth the up front cost, more expensive upkeep, more costly repairs, and higher fuel. When we bought these trucks, diesel was $.60 per gallon cheaper than gas........got 5-8mpg better than the V10, and the upfront cost was just a little over $5k more than the v10. It made sense to go with the diesel then, pulling with it everyday or not. It will still get a Super Duty, just not a diesel unless I find somebody that's giving one a way. Great post Travis.

 

[doctorjj]

Are guys really getting 22mpg out of their ecoboosts? Just curious. I'll be looking for something by the end of the year, and all fo this interests me.

Mine can get better mileage than any V8, depending on how you drive it. It is more susceptible to dropping MPG depending on speed and load compared to a V8. For example, pulling my 21 foot Ranger bass boat to Mississippi and back, running 75-85, we got 12.8 mpg. My dad's 2011 3V 4.6, for example would get 16 in the same situation. Typical empty running on the interstate about 75-80 mph and I get 18-19. Following me home when I went and bought my deuce and a half, running 55 mph, the truck got 26 mpg. So speed and load really make it drop off. If you don't drive over 70, I'm sure you could get over 20 pretty easy. If you drive on back roads and run empty, you can get some really incredible mileage. If 90 percent of the time you are flying down the interstate pulling something, then you'd probably be better off getting a V8. My truck is a 2012 4dr 4wd Platinum, lifted 2". You're welcome to test drive mine if you want, GMT.

 

[JD8]

Mine can get better mileage than any V8, depending on how you drive it. It is more susceptible to dropping MPG depending on speed and load compared to a V8. For example, pulling my 21 foot Ranger bass boat to Mississippi and back, running 75-85, we got 12.8 mpg. My dad's 2011 3V 4.6, for example would get 16 in the same situation. Typical empty running on the interstate about 75-80 mph and I get 18-19. Following me home when I went and bought my deuce and a half, running 55 mph, the truck got 26 mpg. So speed and load really make it drop off. If you don't drive over 70, I'm sure you could get over 20 pretty easy. If you drive on back roads and run empty, you can get some really incredible mileage. If 90 percent of the time you are flying down the interstate pulling something, then you'd probably be better off getting a V8. My truck is a 2012 4dr 4wd Platinum, lifted 2". You're welcome to test drive mine if you want, GMT.

Actually might take ya up on that. I need something in 4wd that will be driven all over the state and north texas. Won't be pulling anything. If I could get 20ish I could live with that. Looked at a FX4 Ecoboost with a 36 gl tank last week that I really liked. Was kinda waiting to see what would happen this year with Dodge or GM, looked at GM/Chevys a couple of weeks ago and was NOT impressed. Love Tundras but geez..... their mpg sucks.

 

[SoonerP226]

looked at GM/Chevys a couple of weeks ago and was NOT impressed.

You don't seem to be alone--the Silverado's sales dropped so far that Dodge almost caught them in January.

 

[excat]

You don't seem to be alone--the Silverado's sales dropped so far that Dodge almost caught them in January.

The new models are hideous, and add in that you can't see the front of the damn thing when you sit in the drivers seat. Poor design all around. They ride decent, and have decent power, but that's all I like about them. GM really blew it this time.

 

[AllOut]

Mine can get better mileage than any V8, depending on how you drive it. It is more susceptible to dropping MPG depending on speed and load compared to a V8. For example, pulling my 21 foot Ranger bass boat to Mississippi and back, running 75-85, we got 12.8 mpg. My dad's 2011 3V 4.6, for example would get 16 in the same situation. Typical empty running on the interstate about 75-80 mph and I get 18-19. Following me home when I went and bought my deuce and a half, running 55 mph, the truck got 26 mpg. So speed and load really make it drop off. If you don't drive over 70, I'm sure you could get over 20 pretty easy. If you drive on back roads and run empty, you can get some really incredible mileage. If 90 percent of the time you are flying down the interstate pulling something, then you'd probably be better off getting a V8. My truck is a 2012 4dr 4wd Platinum, lifted 2". You're welcome to test drive mine if you want, GMT.

It's all about staying out of the Turbos. Keep the boost down and the mileage is ok. Get in to it a run up some boost and it'll pour the fuel in to match. It's the nature of the beast with turboed engines. Problem with that is the truck is nothing without the turbos. So unless you don't want any power at all you gotta have it boosted up.

 

[doctorjj]

It's all about staying out of the Turbos. Keep the boost down and the mileage is ok. Get in to it a run up some boost and it'll pour the fuel in to match. It's the nature of the beast with turboed engines. Problem with that is the truck is nothing without the turbos. So unless you don't want any power at all you gotta have it boosted up.

But that's kind of the whole point. Not using the power when you don't need it and thus saving on fuel, but then still having the power when you do need it. So for the 99% of the time you're driving around, it's like you have a nice 6 cylinder. But being able to instantaneously swap in a strong V8 when you hook onto your boat or when the guy in the Hemi at the stoplight thinks his truck is fast. Four out of the 5 vehicles I own are boosted. I know all about turbos.

 

[doctorjj]

Actually might take ya up on that. I need something in 4wd that will be driven all over the state and north texas. Won't be pulling anything. If I could get 20ish I could live with that. Looked at a FX4 Ecoboost with a 36 gl tank last week that I really liked. Was kinda waiting to see what would happen this year with Dodge or GM, looked at GM/Chevys a couple of weeks ago and was NOT impressed. Love Tundras but geez..... their mpg sucks.

If you aren't a speed demon, you can get over 20. No problem. If you do a lot of highway driving at speeds 75 and over, I'd seriously look at a nice used 2011 3v 4.6 Ford. Easily the best combination of power and fuel mileage of any recent truck made. Every one I ever drove got well better than their EPA rating.

 

[Travis798]

I've got 321k on a 03' 6.0l powerstoke, that's given me very little trouble, all major parts are still orignial (turbo, half the injectors, tranny, transfer case, rear end, wiring harness, etc) probably 75% dirt roads/25% highway. 02' Excursion witha 7.3l.......same story. My next truck won't be a diesel, IMO if you don't pull with your truck everyday and need the torque, it's not worth the up front cost, more expensive upkeep, more costly repairs, and higher fuel. When we bought these trucks, diesel was $.60 per gallon cheaper than gas........got 5-8mpg better than the V10, and the upfront cost was just a little over $5k more than the v10. It made sense to go with the diesel then, pulling with it everyday or not. It will still get a Super Duty, just not a diesel unless I find somebody that's giving one a way. Great post Travis.

I have a 2000 Ford with the 7.3 that has given me no problems, other than the cam position sensor. Those engines fall in line with the older, noisy, lower injection pressure diesels that actually had some reliability to them. Of course, the old 7.3 is pretty gutless, and without a programmer on it I will wonder if it will have enough power to pull its self up a hill. It's amazing how we all thought these things were power houses back when they came out. To go along with that lack of power, on a good day, driving downhill with the wind at my tailgate, I can probably get 13 mpg out of her. I still love the ole girl though. She's what I'm driving while my dodge is in the shop.

I have another Dodge, an 02 with the 24 valve Cummins in it. I lost that engine at about 150k, but it wasn't really the fault of the engine. A dealership in new mexico crushed the oil pan and didn't bother to tell me about it, and bits of metal from the crushed screen in the bottom of the oil pan trashed that engine. Even after spending 10k on it at Cummins having them do a full rebuild, she's just never been quite the same, so I just use her for my fishing truck these days.

The point is, those of us that own and deal with diesel trucks on a daily basis can probably mostly agree that a diesel half ton just isn't going to be a great buy. At one time I was excited for the rumors of a smaller diesel pickup, but more and more every year I lean closer and closer to finding a way to make a gas truck work for me. Even if I take a mileage hit, the lower costs to maintain will even it out I think. I'm so tired of dealing with the reliability issues of the newer diesels that I'm even considering buying a gas truck and paying someone to haul my fifth wheel from job to job if the truck can't pull it. I still think I could come out cheaper.

 

[farmerbyron]

I own 3 diesel trucks, so I feel I'm speaking from experience when I say this. Diesel engines have been ruined by EPA regulations. Gas is the cheaper option.

Gas engines these days last for as long or longer than their diesel counterparts. The days of million mile diesels are gone. Being a pipeline welder who uses his truck for work, most everyone I know drives diesel trucks. Most of them are lucky to get 200k miles out of them. Diesels are more expensive to service and maintain. When you lose an injector, you can replace an entire gas engine for the money it would cost to replace just your fuel injectors on a diesel. I recently lost an injector in my 05 dodge, and although I spent 3k and replaced them within a week of noticing I had a problem, the damage to that cylinder was already done and it is currently getting a rebuild for 6k. That will 9k spent on that truck for one bad injector. That pricing is assuming everything else on the engine is still good, which with only 130k miles I hope I'm getting off easy.

This new diesel will also require Diesel Exhaust Fluid, so don't forget to factor the cost of filling that tank when figuring your mileage savings. You also have to really stay on top of your filtration. Letting your fuel filter go to long without changing it can let a tiny speck of dirt pass through and destroy a high pressure injector, leading to further engine damage. If you let your air filter go too long, you can let dirt through to dust and kill your turbo as well.

If you factor in the extra up front cost of a diesel at purchase, combined with the higher price of the fuel at the pump, plus the extra maintenance and repair costs, you will see that unless you actually need that extra low end power for pulling heavy loads, which you won't be doing with a 1500, diesel is just a bad buy.

There is certainly a lot of truth to what you are saying. Had to get new O2 sensors on my feed truck the other day. Service guy said it was probably due to all the emissions crap coupled with low speed driving while feeding cattle.

I shudder to think what kind of mileage could be had if the EPA would ease up. I think there are a lot of diesels rolling around Europe getting 50mpg but can't pass emissions here.

My dad's 03 cummins gets better mpgs than either the 07 or my 12. Things started going downhill when they added the particulate filter in 07.