question for the Christ believers

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Preacherman

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[3] Jesus answered, and said to him: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
[4] Nicodemus saith to him: How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born again?
[5] Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Jesus clarified to Nicodemus that by "born again", he was referring to Baptism.
Is the word baptism in the text? The reference is that one must be born again through a spiritual birth. Btw this is not meant to be a debate on theology. 😀
 
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JD8

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do you think suicide would be more traumatic for them than watching while cancer eats my esophagus and trachea as I struggle to breath or swallow with my throat so swollen my tongue will hang out of my mouth and die a slow painful death? I'm not trying to be rude at all just saying I know which I think is worse.
don't take this wrong I appreciate you

They are both horrible. Suicide screwed up my family something fierce....... and watching my dad waste away for 1.5 years was the worst experience of my life.

I have no advice on your situation, but just to relay both situations can mess up a family. Ultimately I believe it should be in the hands of the person going through the pain every day. It's their decision and as much as I would hate it, I can respect it. Kind of selfish of me to think otherwise?
 

1Mudman

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After losing my mother and father both to long term disease and watching them suffer for months and months. My father had told me that when it was so bad and he was couldn't help or be of use to anyone that he would end his life. His cancer started as a little tick sized wart and after he messed with it and had the neighbors try to remove it. He went to the Dr and the Dr. cut it out but didnt get it all. He had a surgery to remove the cancer but they didnt get it all either. Then it started growing and there was nothing they could do really, so he went home and Dad had excepted that it was his time to go. Over a period of 9 months he lost 150 lbs, had grown a mass on his upper back and shoulder that you could only imagine in a horror movie. Myself, brother and some very good friends help him so he could die at home. One of his good friends was a Dr and kept me filled in on what was going on and when he expected him to pass. My brother and my mothers B-days were September 1st and he called that night and just talked about and laughed about a few things. I didnt realize he was telling me Goodbye. Sure enough, he took a overdose and plenty of pills that kept him from vomiting and one of his friend stopped by to check on him the next morning and he was gone! He had a girl friend and had set it up for her to come by and get him for breakfast and to take pictures together. He didnt want to be found by the flies first. My father had told me and my brother that he was going to do this and at least he died in his home and thats what he wanted. He did not want to be in a nursing home at all. I have to think that God would forgive people in horrendous pain and there is no options to live to forgive them. I have to believe someone that has been living in a terrible depression and having mental problems of some sort would be forgiven as well. They are suffering and have a disease also. My only regret is that I wish he would have told me in that last phone call and I would have driven 6 hrs to at least be with him. Its been 20 yrs now and I still miss him and mom everyday.
 

Fredkrueger100

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Do you believe if a person ends their own life that precludes you from going to Heaven? in cases where people have intense suffering I wonder if God would hold it against them
Man I’m a Christian and wonder this as well. I have always believed that a person would go to hell because they willfully committed a sin and could not repent of it. So how can a person be forgiven if they haven’t even repented for that sin? Man if you are thinking about taking your life please reach out to me. My son is really struggling with this right this moment. He sees a therapist but still struggles. It’s a very hard thing to deal with. I’m also having trouble getting him to live for Christ. Nothing is worth taking your life over. No matter how bad things get. As someone said already, God will not allow us to deal with more than we can deal with. But, that is for actual Christian’s living for the lord. We have to be living every day for Christ. Sure we will always sin and make mistakes, but, when we are covered by the blood of Jesus we can be forgiven. A family friend of ours was suffering from cancer and knew he was gonna die. Rather than want to kill himself, he said that what he was going through was nothing compared to what Christ endured. He could have given up but he didn’t.

And I will end with this, God did not spare his own Son from suffering and dying for us. Even though Christ begged for God to allow that “cup to pass from him”. If God wouldn’t spare his own son, why would he spare a human being for Killing themselves? No matter what we go through, it is nothing compared to what Christ endured.
 
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Okie4570

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Man I’m a Christian and wonder this as well. I have always believed that a person would go to hell because they willfully committed a sin and could not repent of it. So how can a person be forgiven if they haven’t even repented for that sin? Man if you are thinking about taking your life please reach out to me. My son is really struggling with this right this moment. He sees a therapist but still struggles. It’s a very hard thing to deal with. I’m also having trouble getting him to live for Christ. Nothing is worth taking your life over. No matter how bad things get. As someone said already, God will not allow us to deal with more than we can deal with. But, that is for actual Christian’s living for the lord. We have to be living every day for Christ. Sure we will always sin and make mistakes, but, when we are covered by the blood of Jesus we can be forgiven. A family friend of ours was suffering from cancer and knew he was gonna die. Rather than want to kill himself, he said that what he was going through was nothing compared to what Christ endured. He could have given up but he didn’t.

And I will end with this, God did not spare his own Son from suffering and dying for us. Even though Christ begged for God to allow that “cup to pass from him”. If God wouldn’t spare his own son, why would he spare a human being for Killing themselves? No matter what we go through, it is nothing compared to what Christ endured.
You have never and will never repent for every one of your sins individually either by mouth or by thought(none of us can), that's the entire reason that Christ came, died and rose again, he did that for you because you are not capable of doing that on your own. That's why salvation is not based on works, living a Christian walk "may be" considered to be, but salvation is not based on works, even confession. Forgiveness of sin for salvation needs to occur only one time, that's the beauty of it. Religion tries to muddy the water with rules, and rules and more rules. Humans fail when rules are involved, always.

An example I give often. What happens to a devout Catholic who dies in a car wreck on his way to confession? What happens to a non-devout Catholic who dies in a car wreck on his way to confession? Is there any difference between the two?
 

Fredkrueger100

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You have never and will never repent for every one of your sins individually either by mouth or by thought(none of us can), that's the entire reason that Christ came, died and rose again, he did that for you because you are not capable of doing that on your own. That's why salvation is not based on works, living a Christian walk "may be" considered to be, but salvation is not based on works, even confession. Forgiveness of sin for salvation needs to occur only one time, that's the beauty of it. Religion tries to muddy the water with rules, and rules and more rules. Humans fail when rules are involved, always.

An example I give often. What happens to a devout Catholic who dies in a car wreck on his way to confession? What happens to a non-devout Catholic who dies in a car wreck on his way to confession? Is there any difference between the two?
To be fair, Catholics are not Christians. But you are right that we are not saved by works. But we must do works as part of our walk. Salvation is able to be attained when one has believed in Jesus, repented of our sins, been baptized (immersed) to have our sins forgiven, and then walk in the light. Being covered by the blood of Christ is what washes our sins away. But we must be born again of water and the spirit. This was from Christ himself.
 

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