A SWAT Raid Based On Faulty Info Kills a Man Over His ‘Huge Stash.’ Worth Maybe $2

[Coded-Dude]

But without these unwarranted no-knock raids, SWAT in most places would get no live training(only simulations), and they would lose money by not being able to seize assets or justify their expenses of equipment and training(if they only get a call once a year or less). The war on drugs(even $2 worth of pot) keeps them financed and ensures job security. This is a big reason police and prison unions are against legalization(or decriminalization).....they stand to lose millions if not billions in funding and jobs.

IT'S FOR THE DAMN CHILDREN PEOPLE!

 

[Glocktogo]

Just following orders wasn't a defense in the Nuremberg Trials. It's not a defense here. Look, I'm not opposed to police agencies having a certain level of military style equipment and training, because there are events like the LA massacre, and you have to be able to respond to that sort of thing. Tactical teams, however, should be used extremely sparingly. An oath is an oath. The job of the police is to protect the civil liberties of the citizens. You protect them no matter what, even if it means you have to protect the citizens from your own boss. It's the same oath regardless of if you're the chief of police, or the point man in a raid. No excuses.

You're comparing a war crimes tribunal under DoD and Geneva Conventions, to civilian U.S. criminal law. Are you saying you want all U.S. citizen placed under military law?

 

[R. Johnson]

You're comparing a war crimes tribunal under DoD and Geneva Conventions, to civilian U.S. criminal law. Are you saying you want all U.S. citizen placed under military law?

Of course not, it's just an analogy to demonstrate that "just following orders," isn't an excuse for violating someone's civil liberties.

 

[SoonerP226]

Of course not, it's just an analogy to demonstrate that "just following orders," isn't an excuse for violating someone's civil liberties.

Apples and cauliflowers. What the defendants at Nuremberg had done were things that they knew (or should have known) were illegal. The guy on an entry team kicking in the door is doing something that he knows (or at least believes) is perfectly legal.

 

[aarondhgraham]

I honestly can't believe what I'm reading here.

Apples and cauliflowers. What the defendants at Nuremberg had done were things that they knew (or should have known) were illegal. The guy on an entry team kicking in the door is doing something that he knows (or at least believes) is perfectly legal.

An innocent man is dead and we're supposed to let this slide?

The people who authorized the no knock should be prosecuted for murder,,,
I honestly don't care that they were "just doing their job",,,
They did their job very badly and a man died,,,
They should not be allowed to slide.

Aarond

.

 

[Glocktogo]

Of course not, it's just an analogy to demonstrate that "just following orders," isn't an excuse for violating someone's civil liberties.

Thanks, yours was the second response I was getting some "Animal Farm" vibes from. I do however have to agree with SoonerP226 regarding the point man.

I honestly can't believe what I'm reading here.

An innocent man is dead and we're supposed to let this slide?

The people who authorized the no knock should be prosecuted for murder,,,
I honestly don't care that they were "just doing their job",,,
They did their job very badly and a man died,,,
They should not be allowed to slide.

Aarond

.

Again, what can't you believe? I don't think a single person in this thread disagrees that the persons authorizing and or initiation/planning the no-knock should be prosecuted criminally. We're past that and discussing the people executing the service they had no reason to believe wasn't completely legit.

 

[sh00ter]

well nobody will be held to account because if a good cop comes forward to blow the whistle, this happens sometimes:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...e-brutality-case-told-snitch-career-done.html

We need good the cops to work diligently to separate themselves from bad ones (which is probably still a minority but things have gotten worse in the last 10yrs) as much as we need good muslims to condemn bad ones...public opinion is easy to sway if people would just work at it. I think police officers should make 6 figures and all wear body cameras...that would solve a lot to protect them and the citizens.

 

[SoonerP226]

I honestly can't believe what I'm reading here.

That's probably because what you're reading is not what we're posting.

An innocent man is dead and we're supposed to let this slide?

I don't know where you got that from what I posted. All I said was that you can't compare a situation in which someone was knowingly doing something blatantly illegal with a situation where someone was doing something that is within the bounds of the law; I didn't say nobody should be punished for what happened.

 

[R. Johnson]

Apples and cauliflowers. What the defendants at Nuremberg had done were things that they knew (or should have known) were illegal. The guy on an entry team kicking in the door is doing something that he knows (or at least believes) is perfectly legal.

The guys on the raid know (or should know) that kicking in a guy's door based on intel gleaned from a crook for a victimless crime, and then shooting him for attempting to exercise his God given right to defend himself from an unknown entity that's breaking down his door is heinously wrong.

 

[Dave70968]

I think murder is overcharging; murder, by definition, requires intent. Manslaughter or negligent homicide, however, ought to be on the table.

As to the doc: in general, patients come to them with the understanding of risk; further, the surgeries they perform are (usually) necessary, as lesser means would be insufficient to properly treat the patient.

Police get to choose how to execute their warrants: "dynamically," with guns drawn and lots of confusion, or quietly, surveilling the scene and waiting until the risk is minimized. I'll grant that some situations truly do require dramatic action, but they're few and far between. Hostage scenarios justify it; finding plant matter doesn't. If they want to play commando over something that wouldn't be a capital offense and doesn't already have an innocent life in immediate jeopardy, I don't have any trouble charging them with a crime when their unnecessary actions result in death.