Bloomberg's Coming for Private Sales and Gunshows!

[azmrb]

The difference to me is that one scenario is a private individual(s) exposing a private organization on their willingness to aide and abet a criminal enterprise.

The other is a municipal government actually violating or attempting to violate a federal law while attempting to induce a federally regulated private individual or business in another state in which they have no statutory authority to commit a federal offense.

See the difference?

Um, NO.

They were both attempting to videotape illegal, or possibly illegal activity.

If either one broke a law in doing so they should be held accountable. Private, Municipal, State, or Federal.
I think that was shadow's point, and I agree with him.

We are a nation of laws. They apply to everyone. Or they are supposed to.

 

[mons meg]

Who do they think they are? Texas Rangers?

Worse...New Jersey State Police...

 

[Glocktogo]

Um, NO.

They were both attempting to videotape illegal, or possibly illegal activity.

If either one broke a law in doing so they should be held accountable. Private, Municipal, State, or Federal.
I think that was shadow's point, and I agree with him.

We are a nation of laws. They apply to everyone. Or they are supposed to.

If laws were broken, then they all should be held accountable, I agree.

However, I hold government agents in a position of authority who have been previously informed that their activities are illegal, to a higher standard of care than two twentysomethings (with no authority whatsoever) with a political axe to grind.

Quite frankly, so should you.

 

[azmrb]

If laws were broken, then they all should be held accountable, I agree.

However, I hold government agents in a position of authority who have been previously informed that their activities are illegal, to a higher standard of care than two twentysomethings (with no authority whatsoever) with a political axe to grind.

Quite frankly, so should you.

More Info please? I'm not disputing your word; I just haven't heard/read of it.
Or if I did I forgot during one of my long naps.

Anyway, I would truly enjoy it if Bloomberg has been 'previously informed that their activities are illegal'
OK, I will admit it. It would make my day.


So, you admit it?

 

[Shadowrider]

Um, NO.

They were both attempting to videotape illegal, or possibly illegal activity.

If either one broke a law in doing so they should be held accountable. Private, Municipal, State, or Federal.
I think that was shadow's point, and I agree with him.

We are a nation of laws. They apply to everyone. Or they are supposed to.

I was alluding to that only with a very small dose of tongue in cheek. I mean, lets use the same tactics against them that they use against us for once. I'm sick of the "conservatives" "playing nice" all the time. They keep getting the their heads handed to them, and letting the left get away with their hypocrisy. I'd like to see them step down into the gutter, if that's what it takes, and punch them right in the face just once.

I was also agreeing with GTG's point. Bloomberg did get slapped last time. Evidently he didn't get slapped hard enough to get the point though. Maybe this isn't the best method to slap him, but he definitely needs to be hit harder this time.

 

[Shadowrider]

Hey GTG, who's going to do it? AG, FBI or ATF? I don't see it happening under the current white house occupant.

 

[Shadowrider]

More Info please? I'm not disputing your word; I just haven't heard/read of it.
Or if I did I forgot during one of my long naps.

Anyway, I would truly enjoy it if Bloomberg has been 'previously informed that their activities are illegal'
OK, I will admit it. It would make my day.


So, you admit it?

This wasn't what I was looking for, but it's a start.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/09/nyregion/09guns.html
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1P2-5898292.html

 

[Glocktogo]

More Info please? I'm not disputing your word; I just haven't heard/read of it.
Or if I did I forgot during one of my long naps.

Anyway, I would truly enjoy it if Bloomberg has been 'previously informed that their activities are illegal'
OK, I will admit it. It would make my day.


So, you admit it?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091007/ap_on_re_us/us_nyc_gun_sting

NYC undercover stings expose 'gun show loophole'
By SARA KUGLER, Associated Press Writer Sara Kugler, Associated Press Writer – Wed Oct 7, 4:28 pm ET

NEW YORK – Private unlicensed gun dealers were captured on video selling weapons to undercover investigators who admitted they couldn't pass background checks in a sting operation by Mayor Michael Bloomberg to highlight the "gun show loophole."

The stings, described in a city report and documented on video released at City Hall on Wednesday, were conducted at seven gun shows in Tennessee, Ohio and Nevada. Those states are among the many that permit private unlicensed dealers, known as "occasional sellers," to sell weapons at gun shows without conducting background checks.

Gun-control advocates say the loophole makes it easier for criminals to acquire guns and prevents law enforcement from being able to trace those weapons if they are used in crimes.

Nine states, including New York, have passed laws to close the loophole, requiring background checks on at least all handgun purchases at gun shows. Bloomberg has long campaigned for Congress to close it, and for states to do it on their own if the federal government does not.

Even in states that haven't closed the loophole, federal law bars "occasional sellers" from selling guns to people they have reason to believe would fail background checks.

This is where the Bloomberg operation says 19 out of 30 sellers broke the law during the investigation, in which undercover investigators posing as buyers wore tiny cameras concealed in baseball hats and purses and audio recorders hidden in wristwatches.

In each purchase, the investigator showed interest in buying a gun, agreed on a price and then indicated that he probably could not pass a background check. Most sellers allowed the purchases anyway, responding in some cases by saying, "I couldn't pass one either," or "I don't care," according to the videos.

Two assault rifles and 20 semiautomatic handguns were bought this way, the report said.

"What you just saw was willful disregard of the law, and it happened again and again and again," Bloomberg said, after showing several videos of those sales.

The 11 dealers who refused sales showed they knew the law.

"Once you say that, I'm kind of obligated not to," said one seller on video. "I think that's what the rules are."

"Fact is, you done told me too much," said another who refused. "I wouldn't sell one to you at all."

The Bloomberg administration went ahead with the investigation despite a Department of Justice warning in 2007 that came after the city conducted a similar sting in 2006 to catch straw purchases, which is when someone fills out the paperwork and buys a firearm for another person.

The department warned in a letter to City Hall that such civilian operations risk "legal liabilities" and can "unintentionally interrupt or jeopardize ongoing criminal investigations."

The city has no legal authority over the dealers and is using its findings to make a point about the unregulated sales of so-called "occasional dealers." A copy of the report is being sent to every member of Congress and the findings will be shared the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

ATF spokesman Drew Wade said the agency was reviewing the report and declined to comment on its conclusions or whether the city had acted appropriately.

The National Rifle Association said Wednesday that Bloomberg's sting was nothing more than a publicity stunt.

"If he was serious about curbing crime he would have cooperated with local law enforcement authorities instead of grandstanding at a press conference," NRA spokesman Andrew Arulanandam said.

The undercover operation took place from about May to August and its $1.5 million cost was paid by city taxpayers. The city hired a team of 40 private investigators from an outside firm to make the purchases.

One of the shows — the Bill Goodman Gun & Knife Show — was held the Hara Conference & Exhibition Center in Dayton, Ohio. Hara spokeswoman Karen Wampler said the ATF had a strong presence at the show and that the show's promoter has assured arena officials that any violators would be removed. A message left with promoter Dave Goodman wasn't immediately returned.

The sting comes three years after Bloomberg's administration conducted a similar operation focusing on illegal straw purchases at gun shops in Georgia, Ohio, Pennsylvania, South Carolina and Virginia that authorities believe were responsible for selling guns used in crimes in New York City.

Bloomberg's administration brought a civil case against 27 gun dealers targeted in its 2006 investigation.

As a result of the suit, 20 dealers are being monitored by a court-appointed special master. One is out of business, two more are expected to be put under monitoring agreements and three were dropped from the suit. A final dealer settled with the city but the terms did not include a monitor.

Investigators in this year's sting also attempted straw purchases at gun shows, and were successful 16 out of 17 times.

The mayor said no civil action is planned but that officials are evaluating their options.

Bloomberg knows its illegal for his private dicks to purchase handguns in non-contiguous states and yet he's paying taxpayer dollars to fund this criminal act. His haughty goals do not give him license to commit crimes.

Every one of those 40 investigators should be placed under investigation, and if evidence shows they did purchase handguns out of state, indicted under federal law. Then, Bloomberg should be indicted in federal court for criminal conspiracy.

 

[Glocktogo]

Hey GTG, who's going to do it? AG, FBI or ATF? I don't see it happening under the current white house occupant.

There's not a damn one of them with the stones to indict a potential presidential candidate, liberal or conservative.

They also know how deep his pockets are, and how much liberal press he can bring to bear.

 

[azmrb]

Here is the most disgusting part:

The undercover operation took place from about May to August and its $1.5 million cost was paid by city taxpayers. The city hired a team of 40 private investigators from an outside firm to make the purchases.

Since the operation took place from May-Aug I will retract my original comment about "they probably got the idea from the couple who videotaped acorn".

Maybe it's the other way around?