Bloomberg's Coming for Private Sales and Gunshows!

[Glocktogo]

We agree on this? I may have to rethink my position. LOL

That's ok, I won't tell anyone.

 

[azmrb]

Here is the report if you are interested.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/om/pdf/2009/pr442-09_report.pdf

Pay particular attention to page 14:

A team of 40 private investigators supervised by the global firm, Kroll, Inc. worked for four months to capture
video of gun shows.

Licensed as private investigators in 17 different states, these men and women have more than 460 years of combined law enforcement experience and included many retired federal agents and police officers.

Participants were chosen based on their prior experience conducting undercover operations and performance in carefully constructed simulation exercises. Every investigator who participated in the integrity tests was required to complete an intensive training designed and administered by Kroll.

 

[shortgrass]

Why would anybody in their right mind feel pitty on what was uncovered from those ACORN videos. Hey I feel the same way about anyone breaking the law selling a firearm.

A++ cowzrul! I'll go on to say; Bloomberg is way out of line here. He has no business meddling in anybodys affairs outside of the city of New York. On the other hand, where is ATFE? Are they not supposed to be enforcing firearm laws that are on the books? I've been reluctant to join in on this thread because my views, most likly, aren't the views of most on these forums. Just because you don't like or agree with a law that is on the books doen't mean it should be broken, maybe, you should see if you can get that law changed if it is not a good law.

 

[Rob72]

Here's a tidbit about Kroll, as posted by Paul Gomez, elsewhere:

Been meaning to post about this. Effective September 08, McCann & the other guy [the other former Marine officer/co-founder of Crucible] bought Crucible back from Kroll. Crucible website is dedicated to gov training and this one is looking to focus on primarily private citizen training.

Basically, Kroll is another of the multinational turd-burglers, contracting themselves with the Powers That Be, to keep those lethal small arms(and training) out of the hands of the nasty, vulgar masses.

I haven't watched the vids, but I will note that, "crooked" dealers or not, Kroll has the funding and experience to make things look good on DVR.

 

[Glocktogo]

Page 17 of the report seems to infer that the investigators had in state ID considering the results of their tests:

Almost all private sellers seemed to know laws
prohibiting out-of-state sales.
While sellers were willing to sell to someone who
probably couldn’t pass a background check, most
seemed to be aware that they are prohibited from
selling to people they have reason to believe are not
residents of their own state.69 Investigators observed
that 29 of the 30 sellers (97 percent) asked to see a
driver’s license. Sellers exerted varying degrees of
effort to avoid interstate sales – some took the license,
while others asked that the agent just “flash it” or
said “just show me that you have one.” Two sellers
referenced the fact that ATF or “the feds” had enforced
this requirement at gun shows and in the words of one
seller, “we don’t know who’s watching.”

So why the intellectual dishonesty in not publishing the results of that? Because it doesn't fit their agenda?

On page 15 of the report, they appear to cover their butts by stating that each investigator who participated in the straw purchase is ultimately given the gun

Stage 3 Possession of the Gun: The
Principal subsequently returns the
gun to the female investigator posing
as the Straw, who retains permanent
possession and ownership of it.

I'd imagine that the ATF will use that to say that Bloomberg didn't violate federal laws, but just pretended to do so. However, were those guns were purchased with the investigator's personal funds? I doubt it. If NYC or Kroll (under the cost billed to NYC for the investigation) paid for the guns, I wonder if Bloomberg violated any local, state or federal laws barring the conversion of government funds (remember the 1.5 mil price tag for this sting?) for personal gain. If the investigator in fact did retain "permanent possession and ownership" of the firearm(s), I'd call that a personal gain. If they turned those guns over to NYC or Kroll, I'd call it a straw purchase.

Either way, I'd call that probable cause for an investigation into the specifics of the sting.

Thoughts?

 

[azmrb]

Thoughts?

Nice Try.

Do you think this argument will fly anywhere outside of a gun forum?

 

[Glocktogo]

Nice Try.

Do you think this argument will fly anywhere outside of a gun forum?

It's not like I expect anyone in the .gov to bother using logic.

At least give me credit for reading the damned thing?

 

[tiredofit]

bloomie needs to clean up ny's criminal element before he sticks his fat nose into other state's business.

 

[Shadowrider]

I'd imagine that the ATF will use that to say that Bloomberg didn't violate federal laws, but just pretended to do so. However, were those guns were purchased with the investigator's personal funds? I doubt it. If NYC or Kroll (under the cost billed to NYC for the investigation) paid for the guns, I wonder if Bloomberg violated any local, state or federal laws barring the conversion of government funds (remember the 1.5 mil price tag for this sting?) for personal gain. If the investigator in fact did retain "permanent possession and ownership" of the firearm(s), I'd call that a personal gain. If they turned those guns over to NYC or Kroll, I'd call it a straw purchase.

Either way, I'd call that probable cause for an investigation into the specifics of the sting.

Thoughts?

I wonder if the NRA will pick up on this idea? They might bring enough political pressure to bear. Or at least they are probably the only ones that could.