I'll just put this here.....

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

SM Rider

Sharpshooter
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
206
Reaction score
0
Location
Reality
True, it isn't Islam. It's ideology.



Your "informed" opinion on the matter seems to disregard many facts in evidence. Meeting a couple of Muslims and saying they seemed decent, isn'e an objective measurement by any standard.

Keep in mind I'm not stating they aren't, just pointing out the flaw in your methodology.


As I've said, the actions of a few shouldn't be an indictment of all.
 

OKNewshawk

Sharpshooter
Supporting Member
Special Hen Supporter
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
2,833
Reaction score
2,388
Location
Tulsa, OK
I personally know of two sources where one could purchase the ASV. One is online at Star Bibles. If one happens to be in Amarillo, A&D Bookstore was carrying some in stock when we were there in November.
FYI, I just checked my YouVerse Bible app on my smartphone and the have the ASV. It is streamed and can be downloaded onto your phone for when you do not have internet connectivity. They also provide an audio version. The YouVerse app is free and available for iOS and Android.
 

Shootin 4 Fun

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Feb 23, 2009
Messages
17,852
Reaction score
1,103
Location
Bixby
How often did Americans think of Islam prior to 9/11? Most people never gave it a thought. Since that day, the government has been on a constant diatribe towards Islam and the complicit media has been their means of spreading hatred. This is conditioning and misinformation.

Although I have no use for any religion, to remain quite and not defend those not engaged in the actions of a few would make me no better than those advocating the destruction of Islam as many on this forum are inclined to do.

How often? Quite often in the last 50 years. 20 years ago Muslims were the first suspect in the OKC bombing.
 

TerryMiller

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,906
Reaction score
18,894
Location
Here, but occasionally There.
The bible, quaran and torah all claim to be the word of God. So which of the three can prove they are His words spoken to man?

I don't have a complete answer to this, but here is a comparison among the three. All of the Quran was written by Mohammed. Supposedly, Mohammed simply "held" the pen and Allah moved his hand to write. With the Jewish "holy" book, the Torah, it is comprised of the first five books of the Bible. In the case of the Torah, it was written by Moses with the inspiration from God to write it. With respect to the Bible, it is written by numerous authors, also with the inspiration from God. However, the writings of those authors pretty much complement each other.


I respect your faith, but as dennis pointed out, there are still problems. While that might be the closest translation, the Bible still suffers from a picking and choosing over the years. How many Gospels did not make it into the book? How many years after the death of Jesus were most written? How many of the stories exclude historical context that can help shape and change the meaning? Would a newly discovered gospel even be considered today? Would it be added to the Bible?

Most historical references stuffer from these issues, but the case of the Bible is particularly worrisome because so many people want to find meaning and justification within its pages. So many people seem to consider it to be the literal word of God, an idea that lends the words within the Bible more weight.

I'll need to get in touch with more knowledgeable folks than myself for part of this. From what I can remember of past conversations with said "knowledgeable folks," the books of the Bible were chosen using different but complementary criteria. If I remember right, they were looking at books that had other corroborating evidence, such as eye-witness reports, historical writings, and at most, only "one person away" from actual eye-witness reports.

In one study we had, it was stated that there are up to 24,000 different manuscripts that are about the happenings in the New Testament. I have no idea on the Old Testament, but since Christians live under the New Testament, that is the primary interest to me. A lot of the books of the New Testament are letters to churches and individuals from the Apostles. Those were letters that were used to complement the prophesies of the Old Testament in the newly formed Christian churches to help the new Christians to know about Jesus and how to worship.

Also, depending again on memory, I think the Apostle John was the last to write with Revelation being his latest writing. I understand that his death came about close to the end of the first century, so all the New Testament books were written in that first century. Anything after that would simply be commentary by other non-Apostolic authors that tried to contribute their beliefs to the Bible. Those works would not have been included. Also, any New Testament books also needed to complement the history of the Old Testament with regards to the prophesy of Jesus coming as the Messiah.

And yes, many believe the books of the Bible to be at least inspired by God, thus could be considered as the actual words of God.

Good discussion, Everyone.
 

TerryMiller

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,906
Reaction score
18,894
Location
Here, but occasionally There.
FYI, I just checked my YouVerse Bible app on my smartphone and the have the ASV. It is streamed and can be downloaded onto your phone for when you do not have internet connectivity. They also provide an audio version. The YouVerse app is free and available for iOS and Android.

Yep. On my Android phone, I have My Sword for Android installed and use it a lot in church, and it also has the ASV. For anyone that considers getting some version of the ASV, I should caution them to also have another version nearby. There are some words such as "youward" and "usward" that may need to be checked with another version in order to get the meaning of those strange ones. I use the New American Standard Version for that.

I also noticed on Star Bible's website that they have a new "reference" version of the ASV. Looks like I'm going to have to invest another $100 in a Bible.
 

Glocktogo

Sharpshooter
Supporting Member
Special Hen Supporter
Joined
Jan 12, 2007
Messages
29,551
Reaction score
16,063
Location
Collinsville
How often did Americans think of Islam prior to 9/11? Most people never gave it a thought. Since that day, the government has been on a constant diatribe towards Islam and the complicit media has been their means of spreading hatred. This is conditioning and misinformation.

Although I have no use for any religion, to remain quite and not defend those not engaged in the actions of a few would make me no better than those advocating the destruction of Islam as many on this forum are inclined to do.

What government and media are you talking about? All I've ever seen from our government is the delicate tip toeing around the sensitive subject of Islam. As for media, the only one that seems to question the role of Islam in this mess is FOX.

FWIW, I don't defend religion, I defend just people and condemn bad ideology.

As I've said, the actions of a few shouldn't be an indictment of all.

Other than a minority who are haters, I haven't seen anyone condemn all. All we've condemned is ideological acceptance of the savages, it's up to those who feel "lumped in" to clarify their position. Or not if they so choose, it's their decision to make after all.
 

Dave70968

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Aug 17, 2010
Messages
6,676
Reaction score
4,619
Location
Norman
Your opinion is noted. My opinion is that it religion.

As you point out, it's only a portion who want to send you on to your next life. I'm sure that there are small portions of Jews, Christians and Muslims who would like to send a non-religious person such as myself to hades. Yet I don't take the position of claiming universally that it is all followers of those sects that wish ill upon me. There will always be a few who give the majority a bad name.

Doing something in the name of religion doesn't equate that those doing the crime are disciples of the religion.

True, it isn't Islam. It's ideology.

As I've said, the actions of a few shouldn't be an indictment of all.

These. As several have said, just because some whackjob claims to be acting in the name of (insert idea here), doesn't mean he is.

The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose.
An evil soul producing holy witness
Is like a villain with a smiling cheek,
A goodly apple rotten at the heart:
O, what a goodly outside falsehood hath!
Wm. Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice, Act I, Scene 3.
 

Glocktogo

Sharpshooter
Supporting Member
Special Hen Supporter
Joined
Jan 12, 2007
Messages
29,551
Reaction score
16,063
Location
Collinsville
These. As several have said, just because some whackjob claims to be acting in the name of (insert idea here), doesn't mean he is.

If you're talking about religion, it doesn't mean he isn't either. If you're talking about an ideology, it absolutely does mean that. There is absolutely an ideology that says Sunni Muslims are supreme over all other sects and the world at large. The savages of IS serve this ideology to the extreme. To pretend otherwise is foolish indeed. However, that doesn't mean all Sunni Muslims subscribe to that ideology. neither does it mean that all, or even a majority of them tacitly accept it.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom