Car quality going down the tubes?

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Okie4570

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One thing I've learned about vehicles and internet forums and FB, they attract all the bitching and issue posts, rarely if ever any of the "this is the best vehicle ever" or "I've got 400k miles" posts lol.

Every item ever made can break or break down, except for maybe a shot put lol. How many of you know people who have been buying the same manufacturer or model for their entire life? All of us, why do they do that? It's not because they they're crappy lol. Have people been burned and switched brands absolutely, in general, people are brand loyal for a reason.
 

1shott

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The quality of near everything is down. If your in tune with the world today then your aware of. Today's vehicles are rolling computers, which reflects in the price tag. Not to mention the average Joe can't park it under a shade tree and service it. Fred flintstone never had auto complaints.

IMO with a hand held scan tool anyone can diagnose and re pair their vehicle.

The scan tool just leads you to where you should be looking. Most issues these days are sensor related and most sensors are easy to change.

MAS, MAP and TPS sensors are common areas of failure, as well the cam phase sensors on fords.
 

emapples

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2013s are the worst Subaru of all time according to many. My wife just got a 2022 OutbackLimited a few days ago… so we shall see… Not my choiceMy wife got rid of her 2018 accord sport for it. We did have software issues with the accord and and the ac failed after 3 years and only 30k miles. Mfg defect on the condenser, covered under Honda extending the warranty 10 years on that part.

The paint on my 2015 brz is terrible. Too hard and chips easily. I assume Subaru did not handle the transition away from VOCs in paint well. I’ve had zero problems otherwise.
Well I have been mostly Toyota for 20 years. I bought an Outback in 2018 I think it was , the year they had so many issues with the Harman Kardon head units (Mine went out first 6 months) they the did finally fix that problem. But the dealership pissed me off something fierce when I left it there a week and a half for steering pulling to the right. And after a week and a half I picked back up with no change ( was so pissedI sold it that day and went back to Toyota only cost be 1000 bucks for a car I owned a year. But the reality is there are not many cars that can match the Outback total package of off road or inclement weather capabilities, fuel efficiency, and safety features. The eye sight is by far the best system I have used from any manufacturer. As an example I drove that 2018 from Tulsa to Cheyenne Wyoming November of 2018, and all the way through to Denver it maintained 39.7 MPG, had to stop to refuel in Denver and by the time I finished in Cheyenne it did drop to 37.5 (from an all wheel drive vehicle) that same week a Blizzard hit Cheyenne, I drove all over Cheyenne that week in 8 to 10 inches of snow and it was like having a snowmobile. Drove all the way home through Kansas in the snow storm. It is quite surefooted on snow and ice it‘s astounding (probably why thats’s all you see out west in the snow states is Subaru‘s everywhere.

Because of that experience, Ih bought my wife a 2020 Limited XT, the turbo makes a big difference in drive ability but does effect fuel consumption. I agree with the “we shall see”, I am not 100% convinced the Subaru will last 200K with little more that regular maintenance but we are going to see. The weak point in my opinion is the CVT transmissions I am never really going to like them, but it would appear they are hear to stay. And we have not had any issues with it other than it just being complicated. It’s like being at the controls of a Starship with all the touchscreen crap and when I drive the damn thing it relentlessly bltches at me (for something looking away, or not using a blinker when I am all by myself making a leave change, something has to chirp me) It is like driving with a nag sometimes. You basically can’t drive it unless you put your seatbelt on, not even 20 feet down the street LOL! But when it comes to inclement weather it drives like it‘s on rails.
 

SlugSlinger

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Hyundai’s and kias are supposed to be the most reliable mfgs right now. Honda’s and Toyota’s have dropped.

all mfg reliability dropped across the board during 2020 and 2021.

FYI, if you don’t have push button start, you may want to YouTube how easy your Elantra’s are to steal and add an Immobilizer.

I wouldn’t buy a 2020 or a 2021 vehicle. I’ve seen several lemon law returns based on many issues with these year models. The entire supply line of manufacturing had issues. From inferior materials used in production to poor build quality of the final product.

An example is GM motors have issues with their lifters wearing out in just a few miles due to the wrong hardness of the material. In fact it is so bad that the dealers were starting to replace the lifters before the vehicle left the lot.
 

emapples

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I wouldn’t buy a 2020 or a 2021 vehicle. I’ve seen several lemon law returns based on many issues with these year models. The entire supply line of manufacturing had issues. From inferior materials used in production to poor build quality of the final product.

An example is GM motors have issues with their lifters wearing out in just a few miles due to the wrong hardness of the material. In fact it is so bad that the dealers were starting to replace the lifters before the vehicle left the lot.
GM’s quality systems have been terrible for decades. I mean if you are building OEM engines you should be testing incoming lots of lifters for correct hardness and tolerances before they ever make it to the production floor.
 

emapples

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I wouldn’t buy a 2020 or a 2021 vehicle. I’ve seen several lemon law returns based on many issues with these year models. The entire supply line of manufacturing had issues. From inferior materials used in production to poor build quality of the final product.

An example is GM motors have issues with their lifters wearing out in just a few miles due to the wrong hardness of the material. In fact it is so bad that the dealers were starting to replace the lifters before the vehicle left the lot.
I would agree using Ford as an example here my 2019 F150 had to have cam phasers replaced at 25,000 miles this has been an ongoing issue for a decade with their cam phasers. That’s pre COVID quality problems but since Covid they have had catastrophic engine failures in their new Bronco’s. What should have been the best selling vehicle they have had in decades has turned into a nightmare.
 
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El Pablo

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Well I have been mostly Toyota for 20 years. I bought an Outback in 2018 I think it was , the year they had so many issues with the Harman Kardon head units (Mine went out first 6 months) they the did finally fix that problem. But the dealership pissed me off something fierce when I left it there a week and a half for steering pulling to the right. And after a week and a half I picked back up with no change ( was so pissedI sold it that day and went back to Toyota only cost be 1000 bucks for a car I owned a year. But the reality is there are not many cars that can match the Outback total package of off road or inclement weather capabilities, fuel efficiency, and safety features. The eye sight is by far the best system I have used from any manufacturer. As an example I drove that 2018 from Tulsa to Cheyenne Wyoming November of 2018, and all the way through to Denver it maintained 39.7 MPG, had to stop to refuel in Denver and by the time I finished in Cheyenne it did drop to 37.5 (from an all wheel drive vehicle) that same week a Blizzard hit Cheyenne, I drove all over Cheyenne that week in 8 to 10 inches of snow and it was like having a snowmobile. Drove all the way home through Kansas in the snow storm. It is quite surefooted on snow and ice it‘s astounding (probably why thats’s all you see out west in the snow states is Subaru‘s everywhere.

Because of that experience, Ih bought my wife a 2020 Limited XT, the turbo makes a big difference in drive ability but does effect fuel consumption. I agree with the “we shall see”, I am not 100% convinced the Subaru will last 200K with little more that regular maintenance but we are going to see. The weak point in my opinion is the CVT transmissions I am never really going to like them, but it would appear they are hear to stay. And we have not had any issues with it other than it just being complicated. It’s like being at the controls of a Starship with all the touchscreen crap and when I drive the damn thing it relentlessly bltches at me (for something looking away, or not using a blinker when I am all by myself making a leave change, something has to chirp me) It is like driving with a nag sometimes. You basically can’t drive it unless you put your seatbelt on, not even 20 feet down the street LOL! But when it comes to inclement weather it drives like it‘s on rails.
I feel the same about the cvt and touch screen crap.
 

emapples

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I feel the same about the cvt and touch screen crap.
Yes…yes…but wait till it snows man….. I have had 3 new 4Runner Trails since 2014, and I can tell you the Outback is more capable in snow than all of them. I remember seeing a commercial for the first one probably mid 90’s and I laughed at it, a station wagon,…… Now I own one, It’s hard to fathom
 

swampratt

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How many of you know people who have been buying the same manufacturer or model for their entire life? All of us, why do they do that? It's not because they they're crappy lol. Have people been burned and switched brands absolutely, in general, people are brand loyal for a reason.


I do not have any brand loyalty at all but I do have a parts loyalty.
Motorcraft 2 Barrel. Carter 4 Barrel or Quadrajet.
TH 350 transmission or granny 4 Speed. Ford C5 transmission (JATCO)
Ford 9" rear end.
Gen 1 SBC
Inline 6 cylinder Ford engine .
Inline 6 Nissan Engine and 4 Speed transmission to go with it.

You can't Hook a scanner to my vehicles.
Thank goodness.

I swear you guys are rich to be able to buy new vehicles all the time and enjoy doing it.

I paid 6,000 for my most expensive vehicle. Used 5 year old 1995 Toyota Corolla.
I still have it of course.
I waxed it all the time and it had less than a handful of dinks on it.
Every week I found another door dink and it drove me insane.

If I found the idiot that dinked it I would surely pound his head into his vehicle.
It made me that angry.

I found out then I can't own any expensive vehicle as i would probably kill someone or end up in jail for harming them over a door dink.
Anger issues.. Maybe or maybe I just do not care to deal with idiots.

So I will stick to my old stuff and be happy :)

Lord knows what I would do if a new vehicle under warranty was taken in and not covered for some reason.
I would probably drive it through the glass doors at high speed to return it.
 

El Pablo

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Yes…yes…but wait till it snows man….. I have had 3 new 4Runner Trails since 2014, and I can tell you the Outback is more capable in snow than all of them. I remember seeing a commercial for the first one probably mid 90’s and I laughed at it, a station wagon,…… Now I own one, It’s hard to fathom
I have an 02 wrangler with good all terrains that are snow rated. It’s downright boring on snow. It was terrifying with mud tires.

About to put wildpeak a/t on the outback.I expect the only time we will have an issue is if the snow is flat out too deep.
 

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