Water well/pump pressure question

[perfor8]

Don't confuse pressure with compression. A 'power washer' does not get its' ability to clean from compressing the water (denser?), but rather from increasing the speed (pressure) of the water that leaves the nozzle. A hydro-cutter works the same way. The fluid is not compressed, but pressurized (sped-up) to increase its' abrasive ability to the point of being able to cut through a material.
FACTOID: Did you know that water is the only naturally occuring liquid that expands rather than contracts as it freezes?

I'm not confusing pressure and compression. Water is compressible and compressed for industrial applications, and in nature. The water in your glass at dinner is compressed, due to it's own head (weight) and due to the weight of the atmosphere above it. It's not compressed much, but it's compressed. All matter compresses (occupies less volume) under pressure.

Sorry to detract from the fella's water source issue thread, I'm just trying to elevate the conversation. People like to grab onto an idea, e.g. "water is incompressible" and lock that in as inviolable. That's admirable; I do it too. But like many things, it's more complicated than that. "Water is incompressible" is a generalization. For most common purposes, it can be considered incompressible, because it doesn't compress easily or a lot (relatively) and the compression can be ignored. Oh, and water isn't non-Newtonian, it's the quintessential Newtonian fluid.

 

[Roy14]

I got well paid for.

I'm just trying to elevate the conversation.

 

[jackinok09]

Bigger tank. With proper pressure in bladder will likely solve problem. Also low flow shower head

 

[cowadle]

That's the type pump I mentioned for my off grid. the pump will cut off automatically when the set pressure is achieved ( via no water being pumped ) as long as there is no water leaving the system it stays off. I think you could 'feed' the pump with your low pressure line as well as a no pressure tank.

why not just use the rv pump as the whole system? let it draw from the pond throgh a filter and just pump when the faucet is open. ???

 

[Mr.Glock]

Is there elect close to the pond?

We have placed these .5 hp submersible pumps in 8“ sleeves into ponds and streams.

 

[Decoligny]

I'm having a problem with water pressure at my rural property. The system has always worked, but it has never had great pressure.

Currently we pump water (for handwashing, camping showers and general use outside only) via an approximately 50 foot long tube routed to the deep part of our spring-fed pond. The pump and 5 gallon pressure tank which is charged to 32 PSI per the specs in the pump's instruction manual is located a couple of feet above the normal water line at the edge of the pond and the check valve at the end of the tube is less than six feet below the water surface so effectively we have the equivalent of a water well that is less than 10 feet deep. The pump then pushes the water up the hill, an approximately fifteen foot rise in elevation for about 40 feet into a small shed where we have all of our plumbing connections.

When the pump has been sitting and is fully charged to its maximum 50 PSI we get decent/acceptable pressure at the shower head. As the shower runs, the pump pressure decreases to and comes on again at about 30 PSI. By this time, the shower flow has, of course, become unacceptably weak. In addition to 30 PSI just being pretty low for a shower, the problem is exacerbated by our filter system for which the specs state needs at least 40 PSI to push water through the filters effectively.

Our goal here is a nice 40-50 PSI shower for 10-15 minutes at a time. In addition to losing pressure in our filter (especially below 40 PSI) we know we lose a lot of pressure from the rise from the pump to our building so my thought is to have a supply of water in the building to "get us started". Is that a logical thought and if so what is the best way to do it? I have a couple of ideas but I'd like to get some feedback (or a better but different idea) from anyone in the know:

Our first thought was one of these pressure tanks that have an inflated bladder inside. Some of them spec up over 100 PSI, but I've also read that they need to match the PSI of the lowest output of the pump. I figure that could be solved by a check valve between the original pump/pressure tank and the proposed new pressure tank. I just can't exactly wrap my head around how that would work.

My second thought was for a pressure-less system where our existing pump and pressure tank would fill a holding tank toward the top (but with enough room until "overflow" so that the inlet would eventually be underwater. We would then have an outlet toward the bottom of the tank that would feed a 50 PSI (or so) constant flow pump. There would be less distance, and virtually no rise and enough PSI to push the water through our filtering system. A secondary benefit would be that we could put a time-release chlorine float in the top to help out further with the cleanliness of the water and possibly even give the filter some relief.

I'm leaning toward the second idea at this point as it would be cheaper, easier to maintain and seems to have benefits that a pressure tank system would not, but I'm also looking for an even better idea if anyone has one.

Thanks in advance for any expertise you may share.

Bryan

I ran a community well system for 12 homes for about 10 years.
The easiest fix is to increase the capacity of the pressure tank.
If you have 5 gallon pressure tank, and want to almost double the time at higher pressure, add another 5 gallon pressure tank.
Want triple the time, add a 10 gallon tank.

 

[okietool]

I'm not confusing pressure and compression. Water is compressible and compressed for industrial applications, and in nature. The water in your glass at dinner is compressed, due to it's own head (weight) and due to the weight of the atmosphere above it. It's not compressed much, but it's compressed. All matter compresses (occupies less volume) under pressure.

Sorry to detract from the fella's water source issue thread, I'm just trying to elevate the conversation. People like to grab onto an idea, e.g. "water is incompressible" and lock that in as inviolable. That's admirable; I do it too. But like many things, it's more complicated than that. "Water is incompressible" is a generalization. For most common purposes, it can be considered incompressible, because it doesn't compress easily or a lot (relatively) and the compression can be ignored. Oh, and water isn't non-Newtonian, it's the quintessential Newtonian fluid.

When it got to the part that water has no viscosity, I stopped listening. A Marsh Funnel is used to measure viscosity, you check the accuracy of Marsh funnels with water.

 

[perfor8]

When it got to the part that water has no viscosity, I stopped listening. A Marsh Funnel is used to measure viscosity, you check the accuracy of Marsh funnels with water.

It's the accent. He said, "low viscosity", not "no viscosity".

 

[Chuckie]

It's the accent. He said, "low viscosity", not "no viscosity".

Actually it's the same guy on the video that you talk with in customer service while trying to find your lost part that they swear was shipped to you three days ago

 

[okietool]

It's the accent. He said, "low viscosity", not "no viscosity".

Actually, upon further reflection , there are two viscosity ,measures, funnel and plastic (probably more than two). I was thinking funnel he may have meant plastic. and i'm over this so plastic vis maybe 0 but who cares