Opioid Crisis in OK; Who’s to Blame?

[SoonerP226]

And this is why I don't prescribe this s***. If you want/need/gotta have it, you gotta go to someone else, I ain't doin' it. But you know how many times a week I get guilted, sometimes even threatened?

I don't claim any expertise on this subject, but to me, that bolded part seems like a pretty big red flag that the person applying the guilt/threat has a problem, and that you've done the right thing by not enabling their problem. I know it doesn't mean much, but good for you for doing the right thing.

 

[tRidiot]

I don't claim any expertise on this subject, but to me, that bolded part seems like a pretty big red flag that the person applying the guilt/threat has a problem, and that you've done the right thing by not enabling their problem. I know it doesn't mean much, but good for you for doing the right thing.

Eh, to a degree, yeah. I mean, once people start getting pushy, making veiled threats, etc., I essentially show them the door and advise them I won't be providing their care anymore.

The people who are in constant pain and are looking for some kind of relief are the worst - it's sad to have to say no, but it's almost like being a parent - you have to make hard choices that you know are for the best overall. Can't tell you how many people I've gotten completely OFF pain meds by having a hardline stance that you have to go to pain management to get them. A lot of people don't want to bother driving to Tulsa for them, since we have no one locally who does it. Well, if you can't be bothered to be inconvenienced for them, then you don't NEED them, like ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO HAVE them to get by on a day to day basis. And if there is really ANY other way to get by without, I would say, that's the way to go.

 

[kirk1978]

I'm suing Pizza hut for their commercials that forced me to eat their pizza and be unhealthy!!!! (only asking for 50 million)

 

[DavidMcmillan]

I don't claim any expertise on this subject, but to me, that bolded part seems like a pretty big red flag that the person applying the guilt/threat has a problem, and that you've done the right thing by not enabling their problem. I know it doesn't mean much, but good for you for doing the right thing.

And this is where the dangers in the Red Flag Laws come in. Society is a complicated thing!

 

[druryj]

Eh, there's no way to win.

Either you give the medicine because people are begging for it, and you're trying to help them...

Or you tell them no, they can't be trusted with it, and they're just going to have to suffer.

As a provider, you really can't win. Either way, you're the bad guy.

And this is why I don't prescribe this s***. If you want/need/gotta have it, you gotta go to someone else, I ain't doin' it. But you know how many times a week I get guilted, sometimes even threatened?

Yeah, f*** all this s***.

My regular primary care doctor won’t prescribe opioids any more either. He told me it’s just not worth it from multiple standpoints (and I get it) and referred me to a specialist, a real pain doctor who runs a bonafide pain clinic. And from what I can see, it’s run very tightly. You pee in the cup; you show up short on your prescription; or claim that your pills “got stolen” or you try to take advantage by doctor hopping; pharmacy shopping...and you’re out. O.U.T. Period; no ifs ands or buts.

I even have to coordinate with my pain doc before surgery and HE, NOT the surgeon, prescribes post-op meds. So far, 3 surgeries later, it’s working okay for me. So is the hassle, for what little it is; having to go see him once a month to get my meds.


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[tRidiot]

I'm suing Pizza hut for their commercials that forced me to eat their pizza and be unhealthy!!!! (only asking for 50 million)

How slippery do you think this slope is going to get?

We've got society asking Big .Gov't to hold firearms manufacturers accountable for irresponsible use of firearms, to ban sugary sodas because people can't control themselves, etc.

While there is a place for government protections from extortion, fraud and false advertising, we're on a VERY slippery slope toward a Big Brother protection agency - to protect us from ourselves.

 

[druryj]

Interesting read in the subject for anyone interested:
https://www.realclearbooks.com/2019/04/12/a_blizzard_of_prescriptions_17337.html#!

That really is a very interesting read. I guess I never got the “high” or the buzz or whatever off any opioids. All I seem to get, besides a little relief, is constipated. I can’t take any kind of opioid after about 5 PM either, unless I want to have weird, very disturbing and way too vivid dreams. Which I don’t. Maybe some people are into that; not me!


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[Okie4570]

Thats the d\\most ridiculous thing I've heard today. I hope every state in the nations sues just like this and you can bet your ass, its coming
These companies are killing people and lying about the addiction possibilities.
Drug manufacturers sent half a billion opiates to FL last year..really?

Glad I could fling some reality at you on this fine Monday. Somebody in FL is ordering those opiates...........

Probably this.
My mom killed herself with these over a period of many years. Opiates were her go to.

That being the case I’ve devoted some thought to the subject.

First and foremost my mom. I love her and miss her dearly but we begged her to stop, but she just wasn’t strong enough to walk away from them.

And there lies the crux of the problem. It’s easy to Boomer post and say “Muh personal responsibility!”, but that’s a falsehood. The addictive nature of these opiates is stronger than the will power of most people. They are incredibly difficult to walk away from especially after years of use. The insidious part is that they are designed to be so.
That’s why I blame the corporate entities that created these things-they knew EXACTLY what they were doing and SPECIFICALLY targeted Caucasians with these drugs.

“In 1996, a company called Purdue Pharmaceutical launched a new opiate painkiller called OxyContin. At a party celebrating its release to the public, Richard Sackler, a scion of the family that owns the company and its senior vice president of sales, made exuberant predictions about its success. ‘The launch of OxyContin tablets will be followed by a blizzard of prescriptions that will bury the competition,' he said, according to a lawsuit recently filed against Purdue. ‘The prescription blizzard will be so deep, dense, and white …' (emphasis is mine).

So corporate pharmaceutical agencies are specifically targeting white people for addiction and profit. If only we had elected officials and agencies to stop this sort of thing?

Oh what’s that you say? The FDA accepted the claim from Purdue in 1996 that OxyContin had a less than 1% rate of addiction. I don’t personally believe that the technicians at the FDA are that stupid-they were paid off, as were the politicians that allow these drugs to be mass marketed online and on television. As are the doctors that are rewarded for prescribing more drugs.

So who do you blame? The creator/marketer who knowingly releases a nearly irresistible poison? The government that backs the drug as safe and non-addictive and bans research into genuinely benign alternatives? Or the doctor who, knowing what it is, prescribes these poisons for long periods of abuse?

Or do you blame the poor working class woman who through a life of physical labor gets a permanent back injury, who goes to a doctor she trusts to “do no harm” to her, who sees her elected representatives tell her that the drug her doctor gave her is safe, created by benevolent scientists in the pursuit of health and better living.
I remember the woman my mom was before OxyContin. The thing I buried was just a shell.
She was 51 years old. She never even got to meet her grandchildren.

The loss of life is tragic regardless of who's fault it is, sorry to hear about your mom, I've heard similar stories before.

100% agree. My dad was on opiates for years. He was medically retired out of the ANG with back problems in the very early '80s. Later on he got so bad and his other health issues precluded doing a surgery, so these were his only relief. He probably took them for at least 20 years. He was never addicted. Know why? He simply took them as prescribed. It really is just that simple.

This was/is just yet another shakedown of a large company with deep pockets by an Oklahoma DA. A shakedown under color of law, but a shakedown nonetheless.

ETA: @Grendelshooter I also state with druyj. Condolences for you mother.

In some form or fashion, agreed 100%.

How slippery do you think this slope is going to get?

We've got society asking Big .Gov't to hold firearms manufacturers accountable for irresponsible use of firearms, to ban sugary sodas because people can't control themselves, etc.

While there is a place for government protections from extortion, fraud and false advertising, we're on a VERY slippery slope toward a Big Brother protection agency - to protect us from ourselves.

The "woe's me" and "gimmie gimmie" crowd unfortunately has a pretty loud voice and lawyers willing to listen. So I'm pretty much surrounded by this stuff in some manner frequently. From the EMS aspect, from my wife who's hospital pharmacy, her friends who are retail and hospital pharmacists, friends who are docs, PD, OHP, and SO. There's almost not a day that goes by where I don't hear it mentioned. This stuff is regulated by the manufacturer, FDA, docs, pharmacists and then the end user to follow the prescription. That's more that the gun manufacturers and the auto industry. Nobody has mentioned the nurses that steal opioids and sell them, the pharmacy techs the steal them and sell them..........that happens alot, and they do get caught. There are programs to track who gives what to a patient and it's easy to pin point who's stealing them. Their attitude is the just the the addicted person, "it won't happen to me, I won't get caught". They do, but they also sell some before they caught..............and move on to the next pharmacy or hospital. The state boards don't always revoke their license! They just keep on moving to the next source so they can sell more. The system that links pharmacies together to keep track of narc dispensing is nearly fool proof, no matter how many docs you go to, it will flag the system if you're filling from multiple docs and pharmacies. The addicts are going to have to work at it, and almost have someone working from the inside to make it happen. Yet it keeps happening.

Not one time have I ever heard the parent or spouse of an overdose victim blame a drug company for the dark place that their loved one was in, not one time. "They just were't strong enough to get away from it, and I couldn't help them either." is the most common response.

 

[SoonerP226]

The people who are in constant pain and are looking for some kind of relief are the worst - it's sad to have to say no, but it's almost like being a parent - you have to make hard choices that you know are for the best overall.

I know someone who's in that boat with a back problem; his doctors tried all kinds of stuff to help, but ended up having him go to a pain management specialist. He hates taking drugs (he's still fighting nicotine, and has been since I first met him over 20 years ago), but it sounds like there's no way to cure the underlying problem (something to do with the nerves right next to the spine), so he's kind of stuck with them.

 

[DRC458]

I've got them in the cabinet, but seldom take them (back problems). When I first started with my current PCP, he reviewed all my meds and, when it came to those, he said "I'd rather your pain management doc prescribe those." I do have a separate pain management doc. When it came to refilling them he said, 'you know, they make you and me both feel like criminals.' No big deal, as fair as I'm concerned. Pee in the cup, get your meds, use them like you should (i.e. AS PRESCRIBED), and go on your way. Honestly, at this very moment, I have a 60-day supply in the cabinet that was filled in April. I have had those 60-day supplies last a year or more. I've never gotten a buzz, or a high, or whatever you're supposed to get; but I do personally know people who have gone through rehab because of them (twice).