Chattanooga TN Marine Recruiting Office Shooting

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Sanford

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A mistake to allow an US citizen to be armed? A big mistake to arm all military?

Yes, I believe it would be as big a mistake to arm all military as I believe it would be to allow all US citizens to be armed. Persons in either group who've been found guilty of violent crime come to mind, for one instance.

I also don't believe a US citizen by default has any less right to be armed than a member of the military. What's sufficient (or required) for the former should be sufficient for the latter.
 

druryj

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Yes, I believe it would be as big a mistake to arm all military as I believe it would be to allow all US citizens to be armed. Persons in either group who've been found guilty of violent crime come to mind, for one instance.

I also don't believe a US citizen by default has any less right to be armed than a member of the military. What's sufficient (or required) for the former should be sufficient for the latter.

Kinda apples to eggplants



Sent from my iPhone
 

Sanford

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Yes, I believe it would be as big a mistake to arm all military as I believe it would be to allow all US citizens to be armed. Persons in either group who've been found guilty of violent crime come to mind, for one instance.

I also don't believe a US citizen by default has any less right to be armed than a member of the military. What's sufficient (or required) for the former should be sufficient for the latter.

Kinda apples to eggplants

Referring to which part, and why? Just curious; I know a person in the military today that isn't allowed to possess weapons or ammunition other than as required for performance of her official duties.
 

dennishoddy

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Yes, I believe it would be as big a mistake to arm all military as I believe it would be to allow all US citizens to be armed. Persons in either group who've been found guilty of violent crime come to mind, for one instance.

I also don't believe a US citizen by default has any less right to be armed than a member of the military. What's sufficient (or required) for the former should be sufficient for the latter.

Why a mistake to arm all of the military? Civilians certainly have more rights at this time to carry on the job in some places. The military has zero rights to do this in CONUS unless they are military police or on special detail.
 

Sanford

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Why a mistake to arm all of the military? Civilians certainly have more rights at this time to carry on the job in some places. The military has zero rights to do this in CONUS unless they are military police or on special detail.

Civilians working on military installations have precisely the same rights to be armed as do military, which is essentially none (with a few exceptions as you noted). On most installations neither group can even "leave it in the car" which results in them being unable to be armed when traveling to/from a military installation, also. That's about as obvious a case of "infringement" as I can think of yet it's a fact on most installations today.

My only concern is the use of the term "all" as there are those in both groups (military and civilian) those who have become disqualified (or disqualified themselves) from possession of firearms on a temporary or permanent basis. I would heartily agree that the default should be for anyone to be armed for their own defense or the defense of others, but I also believe there are (and should be) disqualifying factors that need to be taken into account that make the total somewhat less than "all".
 

dennishoddy

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Civilians working on military installations have precisely the same rights to be armed as do military, which is essentially none (with a few exceptions as you noted). On most installations neither group can even "leave it in the car" which results in them being unable to be armed when traveling to/from a military installation, also. That's about as obvious a case of "infringement" as I can think of yet it's a fact on most installations today.

My only concern is the use of the term "all" as there are those in both groups (military and civilian) those who have become disqualified (or disqualified themselves) from possession of firearms on a temporary or permanent basis. I would heartily agree that the default should be for anyone to be armed for their own defense or the defense of others, but I also believe there are (and should be) disqualifying factors that need to be taken into account that make the total somewhat less than "all".

Agree. The disqualifying caveat wasn't mentioned before, or at least I didn't comprehend it in the context of the post.

I never lived on post other than a junior NCO in basic. There were lots of activities that involved guns on base including skeet/trap, and hunting. There were no firearm restrictions at that time. Times have changed, and its not good.
 

farmerbyron

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So, what is your recommendation? Total elimination of the threat; real or potential? And if so, how do we go about accomplishing this?



I have no idea but using the playbook laid out in Mein Kampf probably isn't the answer. Usually the country that sets out to eradicate an entire ethnicity is the bad guy.

Right now a majority of Muslims are not extremists. There are many modern, peaceful Muslims and if you set out to eradicate the world of Islam, that majority of peaceable Muslim will not be so peaceable any more thus compounding the problem. 1.6 billion is a lot more than the western world is capable or willing to destroy.

At least the immediate solution to this particular aspect of radical Islam is to have armed resistance when the ******* extremists attack, such as happened in TX a while back. Or as you mentioned in Moore where, if you'll remember, was stopped by a good guy with a gun. The increased opportunity of armed resistance will not always result in a reduction in the loss of life but at least there would be a greater opportunity to take the pricks down before they fulfilled their mission. These a$$holes have been at this for millennia and it will not end anytime soon. All we can do is mitigate the danger as best we can but calling for the eradication of an entire religion ain't the way to reduce anything but our credibility.
 

druryj

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I have no idea but using the playbook laid out in Mein Kampf probably isn't the answer. Usually the country that sets out to eradicate an entire ethnicity is the bad guy.

Right now a majority of Muslims are not extremists. There are many modern, peaceful Muslims and if you set out to eradicate the world of Islam, that majority of peaceable Muslim will not be so peaceable any more thus compounding the problem. 1.6 billion is a lot more than the western world is capable or willing to destroy.

At least the immediate solution to this particular aspect of radical Islam is to have armed resistance when the ******* extremists attack, such as happened in TX a while back. Or as you mentioned in Moore where, if you'll remember, was stopped by a good guy with a gun. The increased opportunity of armed resistance will not always result in a reduction in the loss of life but at least there would be a greater opportunity to take the pricks down before they fulfilled their mission. These a$$holes have been at this for millennia and it will not end anytime soon. All we can do is mitigate the danger as best we can but calling for the eradication of an entire religion ain't the way to reduce anything but our credibility.

I think you bring out good points. In reality, I too have no acceptable idea how to stop this radical terrorist threat and actions short of the total elimination of islam. But, also in reality, that's not a good, moral, or acceptable answer. I agree that the best we can probably do as citizens is to be prepared in hopes we can mitigate the terrorist acts when they occur, as I think you suggest. And, I think we can all agree that these acts will continue. So think about that the next time you walk into a place where carrying your weapon is prohibited by law, and you "profile" some haji holding a big greasy package or sweating nervously while wearing a heavy coat in the summertime. We are in for a long, difficult and horrible war, a war we don't really know how to fight given the moral, legal, and ethical constraints of our society. Life sure isn't like it used to be; we are just flat not safe anywhere because the battlefield is everywhere.
 

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