Dealing with Mental Health

[trekrok]

Our regular argument against Red Flag laws is the concern for Due Process. The laws "could" be written to adaquately address that. But then the argument would be that the process would take too much time and the individual would be pushed to act faster. So the "correct" response should be to just say, it's the libs fault for eliminating the mental hospitals.

No, that is not the correct response. All of those issues can be resolved if the desire is there. Right now, more and more of the public in general are calling for additional restrictions on firearms and we sit back and say it's not the firearms and besides "What part of shall not be infringed do you not understand", and the response back is "What part of LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness do you not understand". There is much more to the Constitution than the Second Amendment and we sometimes act like the rest of it really doesn't apply.

Either guns are the problem or they are not. I happen to believe they are not. Given that, why should I negotiate away my gun rights? Because someone is screaming about it? That's not compelling to me.

And it's not like we haven't offered solutions. If mental health is too complicated, why not focus on hardening schools? That's concrete and doable. And I believe it could make a difference.

 

[DavidMcmillan]

Guns are a problem, in the wrong hands. The difficult part is determining who those hands belong to.

 

[GC7]

Either guns are the problem or they are not. I happen to believe they are not. Given that, why should I negotiate away my gun rights? Because someone is screaming about it? That's not compelling to me.

And it's not like we haven't offered solutions. If mental health is too complicated, why not focus on hardening schools? That's concrete and doable. And I believe it could make a difference.

Imagine a world where gun owners kept their guns and also spent time on community outreach to keep crazy people from becoming a problem in the first place. (and not just at church - but at secular non profits)

Merely "holding the line" against the libs has been the strategy since the 50s and it hasn't exactly shown to be a great or effective strategy.

 

[HMCS(FMF)Ret.]

Either guns are the problem or they are not. I happen to believe they are not. Given that, why should I negotiate away my gun rights? Because someone is screaming about it? That's not compelling to me.

And it's not like we haven't offered solutions. If mental health is too complicated, why not focus on hardening schools? That's concrete and doable. And I believe it could make a difference.

Better yet. Just home school everyone. Problem solved. Just think of how much money will be saved. No buses, no buildings, huge reduction in teachers needed. It’ll save 670 lives per year and not infringe on anyone’s 2nd amendment rights. Win/win.

 

[OkieMoe]

Agree 100%. Is there nothing more than can be done to address the mental health of a person and their access to a firearm that the firearm community could get onboard with?

And people driven with damaging themselves or others will find something to do it with. Guns or no guns

 

[finishnailer]

Life is inherently unsafe. People are killed in a myriad of ways every day. Guns are a tiny part of those deaths. The media drives the emphasis on guns deaths. Picking mental health and guns as the problem that you feel is the one we should solve seems show a real lack empathy for people who are killed by other means.

 

[trekrok]

Guns are a problem, in the wrong hands. The difficult part is determining who those hands belong to.

So are drugs, buses, cars, fertilizer, matches, knives...

 

[Red Dirt Walker]

How many people were killed in mass shootings last year? Around 670? There were around 7000 killed crossing the street. Over 106,000 died of drug overdoses. You don’t see drug overdoses on the news every day. I’m not saying mass shootings are unimportant, but there are ways to protect people against being victims of mass shootings. This country has around 350 million people. I think people need to take precautions and move on.

Dude, I'm with you, but you are stating numbers....facts....data. Most people in the US don't know those and frankly I don't think many in that group of unknowing care. All they see is another news story about a mentally unhealthy person shooting up some place. The fact that school shootings for example are extremely rare is lost on them as they don't care. All they see is the news report of dead children.
Unfortunately this emotionally driven reaction is a result of media. I'm not a young person so I remember the late 80s and early 90s well. Those years were the highest years on record for firearms deaths. What I don't remember is people feeling panicked about it, like many are now.
From the mid 90s when firearms death began to fall, gun sales continued to increase and this trend continued until 2020 when there was a spike in firearms deaths.
We can throw data and facts at the emotional people all day long, but it won't matter. Politics in many cases and especially Democrats in the case of firearms do not work in facts, but work in emotions and frankly, with most humans, emotions drive them more than facts.
It's for this reason that I think our community needs to fight in the area that the fight it taking place in and not where we think it should be. This means to me, discussing avenues to limit access of firearms to individuals that are suffering from some mental health issue. At least for a time period until it is resolved.

 

[Red Dirt Walker]

Life is inherently unsafe. People are killed in a myriad of ways every day. Guns are a tiny part of those deaths. The media drives the emphasis on guns deaths. Picking mental health and guns as the problem that you feel is the one we should solve seems show a real lack empathy for people who are killed by other means.

Sorry you feel that way because it's untrue. All need to be addressed but instead of juggling 10 balls at one time I just want to juggle 1 and if we solve the problems with that 1 ball, perhaps the means of which we solved that problem can be used on some of the other balls.

 

[OkieMoe]

Dude, I'm with you, but you are stating numbers....facts....data. Most people in the US don't know those and frankly I don't think many in that group of unknowing care. All they see is another news story about a mentally unhealthy person shooting up some place. The fact that school shootings for example are extremely rare is lost on them as they don't care. All they see is the news report of dead children.
Unfortunately this emotionally driven reaction is a result of media. I'm not a young person so I remember the late 80s and early 90s well. Those years were the highest years on record for firearms deaths. What I don't remember is people feeling panicked about it, like many are now.
From the mid 90s when firearms death began to fall, gun sales continued to increase and this trend continued until 2020 when there was a spike in firearms deaths.
We can throw data and facts at the emotional people all day long, but it won't matter. Politics in many cases and especially Democrats in the case of firearms do not work in facts, but work in emotions and frankly, with most humans, emotions drive them more than facts.
It's for this reason that I think our community needs to fight in the area that the fight it taking place in and not where we think it should be. This means to me, discussing avenues to limit access of firearms to individuals that are suffering from some mental health issue. At least for a time period until it is resolved.

He does have a point. More fat like myself people are killed every year because we love food. Yet the media will promote gun deaths like its the ONLY cause of deaths. When someone wants you unarmed. Thats a damn good reason to get backups